Sorry for this delayed response. Getting c4forums back on track.

[danlevine]

Hi Everyone 

 

After reading a post and comments tonight by msgreenf (link), and also personally watching how things have changed around here I really think it's time to fix these issues and bring this community back to being awesome.  Clearly the hands off approach of letting a unmoderated community grow successfully and happily is not as simple as we had hoped.  

 

I would like to utilize this thread for ideas and suggestions that everyone has that we can implement quickly to solve these issues.  

 

Here are a few ideas off the top of my head that I think would be a good start.  

 

1. Bring back moderators to clean up content and potentially mute conversations that are rude or off topic quickly and easily.

 

2. Start banning people and deleting posts that are mean to other people.  There is absolutely no reason to be mean or rude to ANYONE else.  Understandably the internet is a place that allows for that type of activity, but I think we should eradicate it here.  

 

3. (A fun idea) Bi-Monthly real time chat to discuss C4.  This can be a moderated chat session where a panel of community experts can discuss questions or topics that members have.  This discussion could be available for instant search afterwards.  

 

Please let me know your thoughts about these ideas and any ideas you have that you think would help.  I know quite a few of you that I'm sure are itching to jump in and keep this community thriving and I promise with your help to make that happen.

 

Thank you for reading this, I'm sorry that is has taken this long for action but I'm really excited to see what we all come up with together.  

 

Dan

 

[SMHarman]

Changing the setting to allow posters yo edit their posts from infinite to say 2-4 hours. Enough time to fix typos or errors but not to go back and change history.

Overall the self moderation has worked remarkably well here!

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[Matt Lowe]

Think the live chat is a great idea and i would be willing to help in any way that i can!

[alanchow]

I am happy to become a moderator and participate in the bi-monthly chats.  Though the time difference may be an issue.  I am always happy to share my knowledge where possible.

 

I agree that this forum has taken a turn lately and has become unproductive.  At the end of the day i would like to make this an informative site where people can look up information about Control4 and have their questions answered.

 

I think we need to start sorting out posts rather than posting everything under general.  True there are other sections but alot of these go unused.  It would make things alot easier to search.  Also need to stickie a few more of the useful posts (much like what other forums do).

[Tokead]

I am happy to become a moderator and participate in the bi-monthly chats. Though the time difference may be an issue. I am always happy to share my knowledge where possible.

I agree that this forum has taken a turn lately and has become unproductive. At the end of the day i would like to make this an informative site where people can look up information about Control4 and have their questions answered.

I think we need to start sorting out posts rather than posting everything under general. True there are other sections but alot of these go unused. It would make things alot easier to search. Also need to stickie a few more of the useful posts (much like what other forums do).

I agree re sorting posts, but General's picked as it's easy. How about a couple of choices the poster can choose from, and it gets posted against that: kind of like Craigslist. That could also help in searching.

I think the stickie idea is great.

Toke

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[Cyknight]

1 - probably wise though should be applied with limitation.

2 - errrr. a necessary evil at times, but leave that power limited to yourself and at best one or two others. And be carefull in applying

3 - Nice idea.

 

As with others, If I can help, let me know.

[msgreenf]

I agree with Alan.  I think it's important to move threads to from general to the appropriate area.  And splitting conversations that go down an odd path.

[troyfrezze]

I don't feel that this forum has gone down hill or is a failure as some have recently said. I typically check in daily looking for new information, ideas, and more. I think some form of moderation is necessary, but in general we're talking a very select few people that typically turn a discussion from being a discussion into something more akin to an argument over which product is better, why C4 can't be the way they want them to be, or how this user over here sucks. It's childish and immature.

 

As dealers and control4 power users (those who want to educate themselves and do more then the status quo) we are the ones here who have opinions, who want to make things exciting and drive our businesses, as well as our own interest in this company. I agree though that the rudeness needs to stop. I see it to often on here where someone pitches an idea or voices their opinion on something and a veteran member likes to step in and make that person feel inferior. At the same time, I've seen members who continue to go off on tangents every chance they get because Control4 isn't as user friendly as they want it to be. This then simply turns into an argument that ruins the thread.

 

As someone who's directly interacted with C4 CEO Mr. Plaehn, I can assure you he listens to his customers (dealers and customers alike!) and goes out of his way to make them happy. Can I promise you your voices are being heard and he's doing what you want him to do? No...but I can say that man and the team at C4 are truly trying to help everyone out and make the product better.

 

As for this forum, I again agree that some form of management needs to be implemented and used with discretion. I think some chats might be helpful as well allowing more direct interaction with each other that often simply comes out in threads. Seeing as how we're all international members here with some of us in the US, AUS, Europe and more as well as working different times of the day, perhaps having a few scheduled chats would be helpful.

[cdepaola]

This forum, like C4, has a limited audience an audience that will tend to be power users. Power users whom we've been told time and again are a fraction of C4 users. The average C4 user has no need to come here as they don't use ComposerHE and simply call the dealer when an issue arises. A forum full of power users and dealers will have its moments, the two want the same things in many cases but one holds all the power and the other holds very little. As long as everyone remembers it's not personal and try's to think about the other side and what their thoughts and motivations may be then it will work itself out.

Rudeness will happen, though compared to other forums I'm on it's rather mild here. You can shoot for zero but that's not reality.

Things will get off track, as stated before there is only so much to talk about. Only so many ways to program a switch, etc.

I think a productive use of this forum would be as a think tank. You've got end users, dealers, and other industry experts all in one place. I'd love to see some community projects/development. We have a group of what appears to be incredibly smart folks would be nice to find a way to tap that knowledge for the good.


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[turls]

Post editing should not be limited, I find stuff much later sometimes to edit.

 

Agree that topics should be moved to the correct forum, but whoever takes that on should be committed to it, don't move some and not others because it will happen at least daily!

 

Real-time chat, C4 should have facilitated that by now, bring it on!

[Ryanjackson]

I am happy to become a moderator if more are needed. Let me know.

 

Ryan

[SMHarman]

Real-time chat, C4 should have facilitated that by now, bring it on!

It's up the top of the forum already.

Re. Latter editing, quote yourself and add the correction?

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[turls]

It's up the top of the forum already.

Re. Latter editing, quote yourself and add the correction?

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Not sure the forum software allows that kind of control.

 

I mean actual organized scheduled things, I know the forum has the live chat.

[digitaltrader]

I actually think these forums are pretty tame compared to most. The unrest recently is partly related to the frustration of several end users as they watch C4 apparently stay static while the rest of the industry final recognizes that HA is the future. Apple/google and many independents are taking the HA market by storm and C4 has yet to release or announce anything but incremental updates. This in itself has created a level of frustration. The problem arises when the end users get over zealous and trash C4 in turn frustrating the C4 dealers on these forums who rely on C4's reputation on forums like this to maintain their livelihood.

Putting moderator control in the hands of a select few needs to be balanced. While Cytexone One can do whatever they wish, I think a balance of end/dealers needs to be maintained. I have reaped the benefits from some of the dealers here and appreciate their participation.

[cdepaola]

+1

The frustration while maybe premature is warranted. I'm about a year ahead with a similar situation, ecobee vs nest. Ecobee being C4 and nest being Apple/Google. The little guy may still be developing but their cycle is double or triple that of the behemoths.

This is a good forum with generally good people.

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[CFUG]

This idea had a short life-span.  I guess we'll have to wait for the next slanderous post...

[ILoveC4]

This idea had a short life-span. I guess we'll have to wait for the next slanderous post...

Are you surprised by that? Thoughts if change come flying in every year or two, and that's typically as far as they go.

We did get some new categories once, and they update platform... Both of which surprised me, so who knows what might happen.

[CFUG]

Well, given the fact that there is not much action here after "driver wars", something needed to change. 

[AK1]

I would suggest first off we need a statement or re-statement of the mandate of this board.

 

I myself don't find that we have gone too far off track, although I do agree rude and disrespectful behaviour should not be tolerated in this or other online communities.

 

I would suggest that a core mandate of this board is to provide technical assistance to users (actually I find this forum to be of as much technical value on certain issues as the dealer forum) and to this extent I think our forum succeeds.

 

Of late there have been some spirited threads more about C4 corporate policy / direction, dealer-based model, access to CPro and similar issues. I think some of the recent discourteous aspects have emerged in these threads. I believe these types of discussions are legitimate and helpful for this forum. What I personally find particularly unhelpful and likely a contributor to the acrimony is these "canned" responses that some dealers and users tend to throw out there on these types of issues (paraphrasing here):

 

1) "Why bother talking about this because Control4 management doesn't pay attention to these forums"

2) "Why did you buy C4 and not a DIY system if you want more control?"

3) "That's just the way it is with C4"

 

If we are going to go down the road of more active censorship, then I would submit these types of comments should also be removed as well as obviously discourteous postings.

[CFUG]

1) "Why bother talking about this because Control4 management doesn't pay attention to these forums"

2) "Why did you buy C4 and not a DIY system if you want more control?"

3) "That's just the way it is with C4"

 

If we are going to go down the road of more active censorship, then I would submit these types of comments should also be removed as well as obviously discourteous postings.

This is what tweaks YOU?  What about the driver rip-off posts?  You think those should stay?

[AK1]

I didn't think the driver rip off posts need any mention as they are without stating the obvious clearly over the top and should be handled accordingly by a mod.

What "tweaks" me is to have people responding to dialogue proposing changes to the status quo that are met with responses that are essentially "that's the way it is." Hardly conducive to informed discussion.

If it wasn't clear from my post, my suggestion to censor these was of course tongue-in-cheek

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