therockhr Posted September 7, 2017 Share Posted September 7, 2017 http://www.lutron.com/en-US/Products/Pages/WholeHomeSystems/RA2Select/Overview.aspx Lutron released yet another product line called RA2 select. Which looks to be a Smart Bridge Pro that can talk to a subset of Radio Ra2 devices like Maestro dimmers, fan controls, shades, etc. but no keypads; you have to use Picos. All configuration is done through the app should like Caseta/Smart Bridge. Supports up to 100 devices like the Smart Bridge. I did read that this uses standard Lutron commands that homeworks and radiora2 use so existing Lutron drivers for Control4 should work. This has to be one of the most tone deaf and ridiculous product releases I have ever seen. Instead of just doing a software update to the existing Smart Bridge Pro's that allow them to talk to Radio Ra2 devices (they all use the same clear connect RF protocol), they introduce yet another product line. Lutron makes great lighting products but whoever is in charge of their product direction is nuts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mallom Posted September 7, 2017 Share Posted September 7, 2017 This is crazy! It does not even talk to Caseta devices. There has to be something more we are not seeing or was not announced... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gene Posted September 7, 2017 Share Posted September 7, 2017 I agree! They are creating more of a mess unless they get rid of the lower line but from the press releases it seems they have the DIY channel, Lutron RA2 Select for CEPro's, RA2 for CEPro's, wired solutions.... Crazy to add all those resources...something will be gone in a year...hope its not the regular RadioRA2!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
therockhr Posted September 7, 2017 Author Share Posted September 7, 2017 11 minutes ago, Gene said: I agree! They are creating more of a mess unless they get rid of the lower line but from the press releases it seems they have the DIY channel, Lutron RA2 Select for CEPro's, RA2 for CEPro's, wired solutions.... Crazy to add all those resources...something will be gone in a year...hope its not the regular RadioRA2!!!! They should really only have 2 systems; Homeworks and a combo of Caseta/RadioRa2. Homeworks is for pro's only and includes wired and wireless solutions that are configured with a program that can do programming and advanced scenes. The other system uses the Smart Bridge Pro as the hub and lets you buy the Caseta dimmers and accessories through big box stores or you can buy the Maestro dimmers and accessories through an authorized dealer. All devices are configured through the app (which is how it works now for Caseta and this new RA2 select line). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eggzlot Posted September 7, 2017 Share Posted September 7, 2017 3 hours ago, therockhr said: They should really only have 2 systems; Homeworks and a combo of Caseta/RadioRa2. Homeworks is for pro's only and includes wired and wireless solutions that are configured with a program that can do programming and advanced scenes. The other system uses the Smart Bridge Pro as the hub and lets you buy the Caseta dimmers and accessories through big box stores or you can buy the Maestro dimmers and accessories through an authorized dealer. All devices are configured through the app (which is how it works now for Caseta and this new RA2 select line). I agree. Pre RR2 select - about a month ago - I went to the Lutron Experience showroom in NYC. very nice guy running it but I left more confused! I was looking at blinds and Serena vs Sivoia or whatever and RR2 and Caseta etc. seems like blinds are identical but only Sivoia runs on RR2 etc. I can almost grasp it but way too many product lines. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
therockhr Posted September 12, 2017 Author Share Posted September 12, 2017 Looks like RA2 Select will have Control4 SDDP support. I think the RA2 Select actually does fill a gap that was missing between Caseta and RA2 but I think it could have been achieved using the Smart Bridge Pro which is already a Pro product. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mallom Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 This would be great if it could talk to caseta dimmers. Since it does not, I think it is just better to get a RA2 Main repeater. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beemer Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 what would be the price of RA2 Select ...? and looks like the setup is similar to Smart Bridge pro Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elvis Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 26 minutes ago, beemer said: price of RA2 Select I can't find the web page, but I remember reading prices very similar to Caseta. The prices in the article I read were exactly the same as Caseta, but I suppose Caseta is cheaper at big boxes. On 9/7/2017 at 0:23 PM, mallom said: It does not even talk to Caseta devices. But you have an upgrade path, whereas Caseta is a dead-end at 50, right? (I never looked into workarounds going past 50 with Caseta) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elvis Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 4 hours ago, therockhr said: Looks like RA2 Select will have Control4 SDDP support. So why wouldn't I go with this for lighting and shades? Out of box support for Alexa and Siri and Google Home. Am I missing something? If this works as fast as RA2... dang. And SDDP right into my Control4. What am I missing? FS: A boat load of GE Z-wave dimmers/binary switches/fan control/Wink2/ST2 hubs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oscarnyc Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 36 minutes ago, Elvis said: I can't find the web page, but I remember reading prices very similar to Caseta. The prices in the article I read were exactly the same as Caseta, but I suppose Caseta is cheaper at big boxes. As far as I'm aware it uses the sames switches & dimmers as regular RR2, so I would imagine the prices would be the same and thus substantially more expensive than Caseta. Picos would be the same price, just as they are now whether used in Caseta or RR2 setup. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ntlord Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 This RA2 select idea is bonkers. What's the value proposition? DIY'ers can still install RadioRa2?? Why would you install RA2 select when you could just install RadioRa2.... As an aside, Lutron's shades have always pissed me off. Why not integrate Serena shades with RadioRa2 (or I guess Ra2 select now)? Total money grab. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elvis Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 6 hours ago, ntlord said: What's the value proposition? As I see it, the value is the fact that I could pay my dealer to install the controller and a light switch. Then I can add everything myself later. That's why I did not go with RadioRA2 or Control4 switches to begin with. I wasn't willing to pay him to add every plug, light switch, and fan controller. Might be missing something, but the savings could be significant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fluid15 Posted September 13, 2017 Share Posted September 13, 2017 I have been leaning towards RA2 lighting for a new build, to be controlled by C4. I will use a few six button keypads for the busy locations such as kitchen and master bedroom/bath. RA2-Select now has me intrigued from a cost reduction standpoint ( i'm quite sure the house will exceed my planned cost ). Does anyone know if this will integrate with C4 just as cleanly as RA2 ... specifically, will I be able to create the same type of scenes? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mallom Posted September 13, 2017 Share Posted September 13, 2017 I have been leaning towards RA2 lighting for a new build, to be controlled by C4. I will use a few six button keypads for the busy locations such as kitchen and master bedroom/bath. RA2-Select now has me intrigued from a cost reduction standpoint ( i'm quite sure the house will exceed my planned cost ). Does anyone know if this will integrate with C4 just as cleanly as RA2 ... specifically, will I be able to create the same type of scenes? It should. I have Caseta and all my scenes are done in C4 and called via keypad. It works great.If you go with with RA2, I would suggest creating the scenes over the lutron side and then call them via C4 (phantom buttons). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
therockhr Posted September 13, 2017 Author Share Posted September 13, 2017 10 hours ago, fluid15 said: I have been leaning towards RA2 lighting for a new build, to be controlled by C4. I will use a few six button keypads for the busy locations such as kitchen and master bedroom/bath. RA2-Select now has me intrigued from a cost reduction standpoint ( i'm quite sure the house will exceed my planned cost ). Does anyone know if this will integrate with C4 just as cleanly as RA2 ... specifically, will I be able to create the same type of scenes? If I was doing a new build I would go with RA2 Select. The bridge is MSRP $249. It will definitely be able to integrate with C4 as it uses the same integration protocol as the other lutron products. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fluid15 Posted September 13, 2017 Share Posted September 13, 2017 2 hours ago, therockhr said: If I was doing a new build I would go with RA2 Select. The bridge is MSRP $249. It will definitely be able to integrate with C4 as it uses the same integration protocol as the other lutron products. Right now my thought is this would be the desired path - from what I've read on the Lutron site, and on forums, is I would get the same functionality as RA2 but at a lower total cost. Since I plan on using C4 for home automation I don't need a lot of the functionality of a stand-alone RA2 or Homeworks system since C4 will take care of decision making. I'll still be able to use the RA2 multi-button seeTouch Keypads and other architectural options for primary areas, but lower cost Picos (and setup) in areas such as kids rooms/bathrooms/laundry/etc. And initial installation should be drastically reduced. I'm not sure if the Integrator I've been working with will view this as a money loss or see the big picture as more future business. He started off with Savant as my solution, but it didn't seem like a good value or offer anything that C4 can't do (but does have nicer interface). So from his sales perspective it's been lowered from Savant to RA2 to perhaps RA2-select. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oscarnyc Posted September 13, 2017 Share Posted September 13, 2017 20 minutes ago, fluid15 said: I'll still be able to use the RA2 multi-button seeTouch Keypads and other architectural options for primary areas, but lower cost Picos (and setup) in areas such as kids rooms/bathrooms/laundry/etc. And initial installation should be drastically reduced. I think that is incorrect. You can't use the seeTouch keypads in Select, only regular RR2. That is 1) to differentiate and 2) to make programming simpler. Pico's are only scene selectors, they don't have he scene toggle, green, timeclock mode, and path of light options. The idea behind Select is to reduce complexity of programming (hence the pre-engraved pico's which have some pre-set programming I believe), and therefore the total cost of install to the customer. Somewhat analogous to C4 releasing the when/then functionality. Requires a pro for initial setup, but then the customer can take over to a large degree. All these companies are trying to figure out how to navigate the brave new smarthome world. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnpg Posted September 13, 2017 Share Posted September 13, 2017 Is there any reason why you couldn't use the Select bridge and the supported Maestro dimmers for light switches, and also use Control4 keypads? I'd think this would work fine, but I've never seen anyone mention it as an option. The only downside that comes to mind is potentially a different aesthetic between the C4 keypads and the Lutron switches. John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
therockhr Posted September 13, 2017 Author Share Posted September 13, 2017 1 hour ago, fluid15 said: Right now my thought is this would be the desired path - from what I've read on the Lutron site, and on forums, is I would get the same functionality as RA2 but at a lower total cost. Since I plan on using C4 for home automation I don't need a lot of the functionality of a stand-alone RA2 or Homeworks system since C4 will take care of decision making. I'll still be able to use the RA2 multi-button seeTouch Keypads and other architectural options for primary areas, but lower cost Picos (and setup) in areas such as kids rooms/bathrooms/laundry/etc. And initial installation should be drastically reduced. I'm not sure if the Integrator I've been working with will view this as a money loss or see the big picture as more future business. He started off with Savant as my solution, but it didn't seem like a good value or offer anything that C4 can't do (but does have nicer interface). So from his sales perspective it's been lowered from Savant to RA2 to perhaps RA2-select. http://www.lutron.com/en-US/Products/Pages/WholeHomeSystems/RA2Select/Components.aspx seeTouch keypads are not compatible with RA2 Select but if you are using C4 you can just use their keypads anyway and get more functionality. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oscarnyc Posted September 13, 2017 Share Posted September 13, 2017 1 hour ago, johnpg said: Is there any reason why you couldn't use the Select bridge and the supported Maestro dimmers for light switches, and also use Control4 keypads? I'd think this would work fine, but I've never seen anyone mention it as an option. The only downside that comes to mind is potentially a different aesthetic between the C4 keypads and the Lutron switches. John The other question is what is the upside? Why not just get regular RR2? There seems to be a belief that Select is cheaper than RR2, but outside of a few hundred bucks on the repeater/connect bridge everything is the same. You are just limiting your option to use the seeTouch keypads, and fewer integration options. The value proposition for Select, as I understand it from the limited marketing I've seen, is for a homebuilder. Instead of spending $1k on 50 decora dimmers, sell your customer $10k of RR2 dimmers, pocket $6k or whatever, maybe $5500 after the limited programming costs. I'm not even sure you need to take Essentials training, let alone attend a 2 day Inclusive seminar in order to be authorized. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ntlord Posted September 13, 2017 Share Posted September 13, 2017 21 hours ago, Elvis said: As I see it, the value is the fact that I could pay my dealer to install the controller and a light switch. Then I can add everything myself later. That's why I did not go with RadioRA2 or Control4 switches to begin with. I wasn't willing to pay him to add every plug, light switch, and fan controller. Might be missing something, but the savings could be significant. I see your point. But I think the thing you are missing is that you could get "Lutron Certified' in like an hour of your time, and have the same ability with RadioRa2 (but with the expanded product lineup). Now will that RA2 software be as easy to use as the Ra2 select app interface? Probably not. But it is pretty easy to use. I think anyone with a half a brain could figure it out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fluid15 Posted September 13, 2017 Share Posted September 13, 2017 1 hour ago, therockhr said: http://www.lutron.com/en-US/Products/Pages/WholeHomeSystems/RA2Select/Components.aspx seeTouch keypads are not compatible with RA2 Select but if you are using C4 you can just use their keypads anyway and get more functionality. Thanks for the info - but that's a downer, I thought (hoping) this would provide what I wanted but be a cost reduction. I mis-read somewhere that the multi-button seeTouch would work. I probably read multi-button scenes and just assumed that mean seeTouch, but it was referring to the Pico scene Controls. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elvis Posted September 13, 2017 Share Posted September 13, 2017 8 minutes ago, ntlord said: But I think the thing you are missing is that you could get "Lutron Certified' in like an hour of your time Yes, I missed that. I didn't consider that it being simple to get certified. Right now my wife has given the thumbs down to the Maestro dimmers, so might be a mute point. I'll have to look at the RA2 options. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mallom Posted September 13, 2017 Share Posted September 13, 2017 RA2 and Maestro look the samehttps://www.amazon.com/dp/B008X3CHM0/ref=asc_df_B008X3CHM05168197/?tag=hyprod-20&creative=394997&creativeASIN=B008X3CHM0&linkCode=df0&hvadid=167139094796&hvpos=1o1&hvnetw=g&hvrand=7394153483020016859&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=m&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9026847&hvtargid=pla-276878552061https://www.amazon.com/RRD-6CL-WH-Incandescent-CFL-LED-Dimmer/dp/B00JC350NI Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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