Triad Audio Matrix

[rolldog]

I heard Triad (Control4) just released a new matrix that has zero delay. Has anyone heard about this new matrix or know where I can find more information about it? Better yet, has anyone tried it? 

[thegreatheed]

Audio matrix switches having zero delay is quite standard.

 

The Triad audio matrix switches have FANTASTIC audio properties though. Here is the data sheet on it.

 

https://www.control4.com/docs/product/triad-8x8-and-24x24-audio-matrix-switch/all-dealer-triad-data-sheet/english/latest

[rolldog]

Awesome, thanks! I just got my entire house wired using the C4 matrix, but I'm thinking about asking my installer if I can swap it out and pay the difference. I have a lot of devices running and sometimes experience huge delays as the system is working. 

[thegreatheed]

Huge delays in what?

The existing matrix also has zero delay. 

[Cyknight]

32 minutes ago, thegreatheed said:

Huge delays in what?

The existing matrix also has zero delay. 

I'm guessing with sound turning on, to which the matrix indeed contributes nothing at all - the issue there is the system itself, or possibly the amps.

[thegreatheed]

26 minutes ago, Cyknight said:

I'm guessing with sound turning on, to which the matrix indeed contributes nothing at all - the issue there is the system itself, or possibly the amps.

agreed

[rolldog]

Please excuse my ignorance, but this is my first Control4 system, but I'm going to try to explain my setup and if anyone has any suggestions about how to change something, I'd love to hear it.

From what I can tell, I have a 16 channel Control4 amp, which runs my whole home audio, my Sunfire amp, Outlaw amp, Integra pre/pro, and Marantz receiver are dedicated to running my my 5.1 setup and my 7.1.4 setup. I think my Control4 system uses some of the features from my receiver like Pandora and some other streaming apps since I have multiple instances of each.

For example, if I'm just watching TV in the living room and not using the whole home audio, the power light on the front of the Control4 amp is red, like it has a sleep mode or something. If I decide to listen to music by the pool, then I choose pool, then listen, press the app I want to use to listen to music, press play, and then the 16 channel Control4 amp's power light turns from red to blue, since it's powering up to play music in a zone where I don't have a source that's already on. This causes a delay whenever I decide I want to listen to something, just like there would be a delay if I'm in my media room and press my movie button, which powers on the pre/pro, the amps, the Oppo, turns off the lights, and closes the drapes. Now, if all my equipment was on 24/7, I'm sure there wouldn't be a delay, but I don't think keeping everything powered on 24/7 would be good for my equipment even though it's in an air conditioned room. 

Since the 16 channel Control4 amp runs my whole home audio system, if I connect my Ring doorbell to it and set it up to play a specific wav file if someone rings the doorbell, they would probably be inside before it ever played the wav file since the amp has to power on to play an audio file throughout the house. 

[Cyknight]

55 minutes ago, rolldog said:

From what I can tell, I have a 16 channel Control4 amp,

No, you don't. You may have one or more 8-zone POWER amps based on your description.

 

55 minutes ago, rolldog said:

Now, if all my equipment was on 24/7, I'm sure there wouldn't be a delay, but I don't think keeping everything powered on 24/7 would be good for my equipment even though it's in an air conditioned room

Wouldn't be nearly as bad as you think - but the proper way of dong this would be to use a relay to control the power, vs the signal sensing that is likely what is in use right now.

 

Regardless, the delay has NOTHING to do with your audio matrix, and changing to the Triad brand one won't make a wit's difference in this regard.

[rolldog]

You're right, it's an 8 channel amp and a 16 Channel Audio Matrix. I'll ask my installer about a relay. One of the installers told me that he's been testing the Triad at his house and thinks my system would benefit by changing out to the Triad because of everything I have on my C4 system, which boggs it down at times. You seem very knowledgeable about Control4, so if you don't mind, I'll try to list the equipment I have running, and having 80 C4 switches around my house with half of them programmed to do multiple things, maybe you might have some advice about why it gets bogged down and then starts causing delays. 

I don't know if I'll be able to list everything, but this is what I'm using:

 C4 EA-5, C4 LU642D-KIT UHD 6X6 Matrix Kit w/ Dolby Downmixing, C4-16ZAMSV3-B 16 Channel Audio Matrix, C4-AMP108 8 Zone Amp, C4 EA-1, 8 x C4 ZCA-Z2IR10A-ZP Zigbee to IR modules, 5 x Qmotion QIS Roller Shades w/ C4 integration, 3 x C4 T3 in-wall touchscreens, 2 x Glydea Drapery Track System with Somfy Zigbee Interface, 2x Wattbox WB-200-8PS, 2 xWattbox WB-300-IP-3, 3 x C4 T3 tabletop, 2 x MyQ garage door controller, 2 x NYCE Garage Door Tilt Sensors, 3 x C4-THERM-WH thermostats, 8 x C4-SR260RSK remote & charging station, C4-SEC-INT Security Interface, 3 x Kwikset KSC916DB-SN touchscreen deadbolts, 2 x Ring Video Doorbell, 4 x IP Surveillance Turret 4MP, IP Surveillance NVR 4, 28 x Triad in-wall/in-ceiling Silver/6 speakers, 2 x Sonance Mariner 82 White, 9 x 4K UHD HDR TVs, and then I have various AV equipment like a receiver, a pre/pro with a couple of amps, Oppo 203,Xbox One Roku Ultra, 2 x Nvidia Shield, 69 x C4 Keypad Dimmers/Dimmers with 89 engraved buttons, Jandy Pool integration, and I'm sure I've left off a few things, which might not really be important to the delays in my system that I get sometimes. Oh, I also have a QNAP TVS-882 media server with a QNAP TS-451+, which I use as backup. 

 

[RyanE]

Delay also could be to your audio sources.

You didn't mention if you were listening to streaming audio, or local streaming audio, or to some analog source, like an FM tuner.

It's normal to have a small delay before streaming media plays, due to the fact that the Control4 system needs to buffer enough audio to allow for correct audio synchronization between streaming zones, i.e. if some zones are being streamed through the Control4 controller, and others are through the Triad Zone Amplifier, those two streaming endpoints need enough buffer to maintain sync.

Also, Internet streaming buffers quite a bit, due to the possibility that the Internet connection (and any connections between your ISP and the source servers) could vary in it's ability to get the audio to the streaming endpoints.

RyanE

 

[Cyknight]

Like Ryan, I'd ask you to first be a little clearer in what you mean by 'bog down'. What are you actually noticing.

Streaming music slow to sart?

Lights not turning on or off from a touch screen?

Etc.

[rolldog]

On 10/21/2017 at 2:35 PM, Cyknight said:

 

Yes, whenever I want to stream music or if I try to setup my Ring doorbell to play an audio file whenever someone rings the doorbell, there's a delay playing the audio file through my overhead speakers. I get a notification on my cell phone immediately, but there's a delay to play the audio file through the overhead speakers. In some parts of my house, I can't hear the doorbell ring if someone rings it, but if I set it up to play an audio file whenever someone rings it, I don't hear the audio file immediately. Also, in some rooms where I have a TV, if I want to listen to the TV through the overhead speakers, there's a delay in the audio sync, except in the rooms where I have a 5.1 setup through a local receiver or another room where I have a pre/pro and a 7.1.4 setup. If I want to listen to the TV in my outdoor kitchen but hear the audio through the speakers by my pool, there's a lip sync issue. My installer was telling me that with the Triad matrix fixes this audio delay that I'm getting through the C4 system. He said he's been testing it out at home, and that I should probably swap mine out for the newer Triad matrix because it eliminates this audio delay. 

Like I mentioned, I'm not familiar enough with the entire system yet or how it works since I haven't had the system very long (My install isn't even finished yet. I'm only waiting on my new buttons for my switches and a Somfy Glydea drapery motor and the Zigbee interface for the drapes in the media room). My installer was telling me that the newer Triad eliminates some of these little things I'm experiencing with the Control4 system, and since my system is still fairly new, I could swap my matrix out for the newer Triad matrix. He said that it's not much of a difference in price between the two, but I guess that's all relative to how much I've already spent. 

I'm basically just looking for feedback about how the newer Triad compares to the Control4, since it's the same company now. I trust my installer since I've been buying A/V equipment from him since laserdisks were popular and he recommended that I buy a DVD player whenever they came out but sometimes it doesn't hurt to get a third opinion. The Triad system is so new, I can't really find any reviews or comparisons between it and the Control4 system so I figured I would ask here if anyone has actually installed one yet, worked with one long enough to see how it compares to the Control4, and find out in what ways is it better. My installer has had the Triad setup at his house for the last month and been testing it out, but I'd like to know if anyone here has done the same. 

[Cyknight]

Ah that creates some clarity. What your dealer is talking about mainly is adding a device that allows for more advanced audio sync options. The Triad may help there (though I'm not quite convinced), in fact, you have a device that is far better for it already - your HDMI switch with audio outputs. That should have what you need to fix lip-sync.

The slowness on hearing music or audio annaouncments is largely fixed with the before mentioned relay, and more so with updating your system to 2.10 and ensuring advanced audio is up and running.