akg4y Posted May 6, 2009 Share Posted May 6, 2009 If I have a 3-way setup with a light and two switches and I change one of the switches to a C4 dimmer but leave the other one as a conventional switch, what type of switch goes in that location, a 2-way or a 3-way?Also, in a 4 way situation if I have one switch changed to a C4 dimmer, another changed to a keypad, and the third is a conventional switch, should the conventional switch be a 2-way, 3-way, or 4-way? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jberger Posted May 6, 2009 Share Posted May 6, 2009 Typically, you'd use a 2,3 or 6 button keypad to replace the other switches in a 3 or 4 way configuration. The dimmer controls the fixture and the KP just fills the hole and provides control at the 2nd location. I've been changing out 3 and 4 ways around my house and that's my approach. One thing I've learned is that you really need to think about the dimmer placement, since KP's do not work if the controller or zigbee is down. So I've moved the dimmers to the top of each stairwell and room entrance so those areas can be controlled, even if there is an issue with the network. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akg4y Posted May 6, 2009 Author Share Posted May 6, 2009 So is it impossible to leave a conventional switch at the other end? Im just not looking forward to spending $100-150 for keypads etc that for the most part will not be used, plus having a conventional switch could also help me with the problem you mention, giving the ability to turn a light on at that location even if C4 is down, as opposed to the keypad.Actually now that I think about it it seems like you could just wire a conventional two-way switch in lieu of a keypad and it would work since the keypad is essentially getting power from the dimmer but not sending it to the fixture, right? The only issue would be if you turned on the light with the conventional switch then you wouldnt be able to turn it off any other way then with the same switch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RyanE Posted May 6, 2009 Share Posted May 6, 2009 There is no way to reliably (consistently) use a conventional switch with a Control4 dimmer.If the conventional switch is 'after' the Control4 switch, it can switch it off, but since that cuts the current to the load, no matter what you do with the Control4 switch, the load is off.The way to properly do 3- and 4-way switch locations with Control4 is to replace the location where the load wire is with a dimmer, and replace each other location with a Control4 2 button keypad (or a 3 or 6-button keypad if you want additional functionality).RyanE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akg4y Posted May 7, 2009 Author Share Posted May 7, 2009 Man thats frustrating. I have 5 switches controlling my upstairs hallway so that means at a minimum in order to control that via C4 I would have to spend $529+tax.C4 needs to come up with a package price for like a single dimmer and 1,2, or 3 two-button keypads.So theres no way to wire the two in parallel rather than in series, such that if either one is on the light turns on, but you cannot turn it off from another switch? For example, hot goes into the C4 switch, then sends a load to the fixture and a hot to the second switch and the second switch also connects to the load wire leading to the fixture. That way you would have this situation:1. C4 on, conventional off: Light on2. C4 off, conventional on: light on3. C4 off, conventional off: light off4. C4 on, conventional on: light on Basically, the only way the light is off is if BOTH C4 and conventional are set to off. The only issue with this is Im not sure if it would be a code violation, and if not, Im not sure if situation 4 above would blow the fixture since I dont remember my electrophysics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RyanE Posted May 7, 2009 Share Posted May 7, 2009 I don't know if it's a code violation or not, but I'm pretty sure it's not recommended for several reasons. The safety 'air break' on the Control4 dimmer is meant to remove power from the fixture completely, so you can change bulbs knowing the power is off. If you can send power to the light through a switch separately, that's not good.Also, in your little 'matrix', if the conventional switch is on, you can't turn the light off with Control4. Kind of defeats the purpose of having a Control4 dimmer if you don't have a single button that will turn all the house lights off.Yes, it is expensive to have to replace all the 3-way switches with 2-button (or more) keypads, but I think it's pretty necessary if you're going to want control at that location.An alternative would be to wire nut the 3-way locations, and use a blank faceplate. You'd still have control through touchpanels / or at the switch, but you shouldn't do that with dimmers and switches at the top and/or bottom of stairs, because *that* definitely is a code violation.Sorry it's not the answer you were looking for, but it's pretty much the way it is with any automated lights, not just Control4.RyanEP.S. If you do replace some of the 5 locations, I'd suggest you do it with 6-button keypads, because then you could use some of those buttons for lighting scenes, or garage door status buttons, or other functionality that work very well on a 6-button keypad.In my house, I use the 6-button keypads to indicate both garage doors' status (red if open, off if closed), and I use the 3 buttons on the left to indicate if there are any lights on for each of my three floors (0-25% green, 25-50% yellow, 50-75% orange, 75-100% red), and to allow me to turn off all the lights or on all the lights on each of those floors with a single or quadruple tap on the appropriate button. Very handy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akg4y Posted May 7, 2009 Author Share Posted May 7, 2009 Thanks Ryan. Well the idea would be for switches that I would basically never use. For example, for my dining room chandelier there are two switches, one near where we enter most of the the time, and another near the front door which we basically will never use, but if we do we could always just turn it off from the same location.The upstairs hallway situation is a bit different I guess since sometimes you would want to turn the light on from one place (ie near the attic stairs) and then turn it off somewhere else as you leave the hallway.I just need to win the lottery. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RyanE Posted May 7, 2009 Share Posted May 7, 2009 I'd wire the first one (seldom used) with a wirenut (until you win the lottery), and the second, use a Control4 keypad.RyanE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akg4y Posted May 7, 2009 Author Share Posted May 7, 2009 Yeah I think thats the plan... the LOML didnt seem to object to laying out a bit more Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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