Can't begin to say how disappointed I am with this system.

[Cyknight]

51 minutes ago, SurfNTech said:

I'm sitting in the middle of the highway, my car is running but nothing electrical works.

Anyone know how to reboot it?  I knew I shouldn't have bought an Acura, and paid more for one of those higher brands that doesn't lookup and need a reboot now and then.

Funny thing is - this actually happened to me not that long ago. Electronics in the car failed, no powersteering, no transmission - despite the motor running. You're correct I couldn't reboot my car, had to get it towed to a dealership to check it, reset it and pay the price.

 

Go figure.

[Hardware]

3 hours ago, SurfNTech said:

I love how people want to come on here and troll others and hide behind obscurity.  If dealers feel their knowledge is so superior post your name and company details.  Stand fully behind your claims.  I notice the the kind and truly helpful dealers on here do that and have nothing to hide.

The internet is a strange place, where many people act in a way they wouldn't in public or around others.  Also everyone is quick to pass judgement and knows exactly who the other person is regardless of knowing nothing about said person.

Only asshats attack people who spend their own free time helping. It's the exact opposite of what you're complaining about. I wont make a single dollar off anyone here. That is why the majority of the professional market stays off sites like this.

I am sorry you feel I need to list my cell phone number for my input to be adequate . I don't really care. I came on to help people who want help. I have watched this forum for years. I have been in the industry for almost 2 decades. I have been involved with Control4 for as long as you can be. Now that you know how big my dick is, let me repeat what many have already said. You can either ignore what the Control4 end of the argument is, and pretend you know better or you can accept reality. 

btw... it took me a bit to respond. I was busy driving around personally helping others with their system... but I guess I don't act like that in public or around other people. 

[jfh]

3 minutes ago, Hardware said:

Only asshats attack people who spend their own free time helping. 

 

Umm, it looks like you created an ID just to post in this thread.   

[Hardware]

Let me go back to your first thread and let you know that. 

If I joined to try and help people not be "disappointed with this system"...seems like a good place to start?

[Hardware]

and my join date is 5 years ago...

[jfh]

Just now, Hardware said:

and my join date is 5 years ago...

So how much help have you provided here in 5 years if all of your posts are in this thread?

The only help I can see that you've provided is to provide an example of the type of dealer customers should avoid.  Thanks for your contribution.

[Hardware]

Go back and read.  

But to be clear... you don't want qualified people that use their own time to help random customers who they don't make any money off of...

OK. I got it. I have no problem not helping you. 

[jfh]

23 minutes ago, Hardware said:

But to be clear... you don't want qualified people that use their own time to help random customers who they don't make any money off of...

OK. I got it. I have no problem not helping you. 

 

There are plenty of people here that clearly are here to help others.  There's just no evidence you are one of them.  And there is certainly no evidence you're qualified in anything.   So I'm certainly not missing out on anything with you not helping me.  Nor apparently is anyone else. 

 

[Hardware]

8 minutes ago, jfh said:

 

There are plenty of people here that clearly are here to help others.  There's just no evidence you are one of them.  And there is certainly no evidence you're qualified in anything.   So I'm certainly not missing out on anything with you not helping me.  Nor apparently is anyone else. 

 

Im happy you feel that way. Please continue  express your welcoming to all members like a complete ass. I'm sorry my 15 posts haven't provided you with any evidence I could care less about. Again, keep bothering yourself. I'll help those who want it. 

[prabeau]

Good Lord.........realy 

[Engineerisaac]

Hey I've already said this once but I definitely can say it again you got to have a thick skin to be here

I love this forum it has a hell of a comedic Factor dashed with a attempt at helping people mixed in with the herbs and spices of angry customers

Cooked to Perfection for 10 years and served with a glorious announcement attached to a scheduled task

 

Honest when I say this thread is amazing it's totally bringing all the shadow people to light we have a lot of lurkers that were too afraid to post but now I feel like they can in this thread this is actually a good thing for this community in light of how cancerous This Thread is

 

[seth_j]

[dcovach]

We don't need no water

[ntlord]

As I mentioned earlier, we just need to acknowledge that C4’s dealer-only model was and still is a pure money play. And now, the dealer’s are entrenched, making it nearly impossible for C4 to allow for DIY. The dealers would revolt. 

Now I knew this fact when I bought the system, and was ok with it. I still am ok with it. But that doesn’t mean I don’t think C4 should change. I think that’s probably how most of the end users in this thread feel. It would be great if they allowed for DIY.

I just get annoyed when people suggest the end users can’t handle DIY. They defineltly can. For example, someone else in this thread pointed out how a network engineer could be running a Fortune 100 network, but know nothing about how to set up a Control4 network. That’s true. But the sole reason for that is because Control4 hides the information. Don’t think for a second that engineer can’t handle setting up a C4 network. Of course they could. They just need the information from C4. No training required.

[Stevestobo]

My two pence worth. If Control4 are anything like many businesses who have a partner business model it has nothing to do with stopping end users like me having access to everything it is entirely about cost, profit, reducing risk and keeping your channel to market on board, motivated and to keep on selling for you.

if you use partners you get reach, local support, built in sales force, marketing, network of their clients all without hiring your own people. If you deal direct you have to have follow the sun support for level 1, 2 and 3, larger marketing teams, dedicated end user sales reps, huge spend on marketing etc etc. In general a dealer only model is lower cost to setup, gives you a global reach, reduces running costs etc.

But what has that to do with Full access to the software, simple, if Control4 wrote all the drivers and they were built in to the software, then we would have full access to install drivers, add hardware, etc, however as control4 have opened up their software to allow 3rd party written drivers to be installed it introduce huge risk and potential support issues. 

so in order to give us the great 3rd party drivers and the huge amount of drivers to support hundreds of different devices they lock that part out so only dealers can do it, reason being that the dealer is ultimately responsible now for supporting it, but more importantly it protects the dealer and guarantees him revenue for installing and/or selling the driver itself.

Having worked for both vendors and dealers you need to motivate your channel to market to sell your products and not the competition, you can do that with the best product, most discount, deal registration, MDF, incentives etc. Or......you lock the software to the dealer and only allow him to install certain parts guaranteeing users like me to come back to them to buy more drivers and more stuff, perfect business model, reduce cost, reduce risk and have a motivated, loyal and profitable dealers that sell more.

or Control4 think we are dumb muppets that can’t be trusted to wire a kettle let alone install anything. Oh, I fit in to this part, ask my wife and my dealer !

 

[prabeau]

5 hours ago, Stevestobo said:

My two pence worth. If Control4 are anything like many businesses who have a partner business model it has nothing to do with stopping end users like me having access to everything it is entirely about cost, profit, reducing risk and keeping your channel to market on board, motivated and to keep on selling for you.

if you use partners you get reach, local support, built in sales force, marketing, network of their clients all without hiring your own people. If you deal direct you have to have follow the sun support for level 1, 2 and 3, larger marketing teams, dedicated end user sales reps, huge spend on marketing etc etc. In general a dealer only model is lower cost to setup, gives you a global reach, reduces running costs etc.

But what has that to do with Full access to the software, simple, if Control4 wrote all the drivers and they were built in to the software, then we would have full access to install drivers, add hardware, etc, however as control4 have opened up their software to allow 3rd party written drivers to be installed it introduce huge risk and potential support issues. 

so in order to give us the great 3rd party drivers and the huge amount of drivers to support hundreds of different devices they lock that part out so only dealers can do it, reason being that the dealer is ultimately responsible now for supporting it, but more importantly it protects the dealer and guarantees him revenue for installing and/or selling the driver itself.

Having worked for both vendors and dealers you need to motivate your channel to market to sell your products and not the competition, you can do that with the best product, most discount, deal registration, MDF, incentives etc. Or......you lock the software to the dealer and only allow him to install certain parts guaranteeing users like me to come back to them to buy more drivers and more stuff, perfect business model, reduce cost, reduce risk and have a motivated, loyal and profitable dealers that sell more.

or Control4 think we are dumb muppets that can’t be trusted to wire a kettle let alone install anything. Oh, I fit in to this part, ask my wife and my dealer !

 

I'll pass

[South Africa C4 user]

Wow! Took me half an hour to skim read this entire topic.  Definitely not half an hour well spent! Rather sad actually.

For what it is worth, I think that this is a great forum with phenomenal dealer support and some very knowledgeable end users as well as the real novices (who tend to become very knowledgeable end users quite quickly if they are involved in the forum for any length of time).  This topic tries (innocently, I assume), by in large, to pit dealers against users.  A very dangerous proposition.

I happen to fall on the side of the argument that says give end users Pro if they want it and are happy to take the risk.  Equally, I never expect this to happen and I fully respect Control4’s decision and, actually, fully understand it as the moans would simply be different if we (end users) had access to Pro.  Some of us would stuff things up royally and some of us would blame Control4!

All that said, HE and the Greenfields Device Renamer driver give a remarkable amount of flexibility and control which is practically unrivaled out there in the market.  I do think that a dealer proposition where dealers offer to install test versions of drivers for free (and only charge if you actually buy the driver) rounds things off nicely.  I am in the fortunate position, like an earlier poster,  where I enjoy this service and it really works for me.

To conclude, I do find it rather sad that we have spent 10 pages on this and hope that we move on to more exciting challenges (time for a new OS release me thinks...).  There were rumors of this and the Intercom App all being in the first week of May.  Side note to C4: this would be a great diversion right now! . Don’t think this forum has the patience to wait for CEDIA!

More seriously, lets keep this respectful.  After all, we all love the system and want to see C4 succeed and prosper and our individual systems grow from strength to strength.  As Wap would say (on one of his quieter days): rock on C4.

 

[88Tiger88]

On 4/26/2018 at 2:14 PM, eggzlot said:

i aint a dealer, sorry.  I could share older posts where people mentioned how to dumb down a managed switch but that is about all I got.  And its worked for me.  I went into my switches and things are now more stable.  

So what you said is managed switch has no advantage to unmanaged switch?  Is any advantage use RK-1 with flat network, instead of multiple VLAN with different priorities?

[msgreenf]

2 minutes ago, 88Tiger88 said:

So what you said is managed switch has no advantage to unmanaged switch?  Is any advantage use RK-1 with flat network, instead of multiple VLAN with different priorities?

most of the time managed switches cause more problems if you don't all inter vlan traffic.  It's much simpler to have a flat network at home.

[Hardware]

2 minutes ago, 88Tiger88 said:

So what you said is managed switch has no advantage to unmanaged switch?  Is any advantage use RK-1 with flat network, instead of multiple VLAN with different priorities?

Depends on the size and needs of the network. For most, a flat network is fine. 

[88Tiger88]

3 hours ago, msgreenf said:

most of the time managed switches cause more problems if you don't all inter vlan traffic.  It's much simpler to have a flat network at home.

Thanks for your input.   So RK-1 wth flat configuration should be good to stream high res audio from NAS drive and music stream service along with few home computer stream in parallel?   Is RK-1 performance, security and build quality better than mikrotik? It is pretty pricy for home AV router.  

[88Tiger88]

3 hours ago, Hardware said:

Depends on the size and needs of the network. For most, a flat network is fine. 

Thanks for reply. My home AV system plus all devices are under 24,  network stream devices are under 6.  I do notice RK-1 is significantly faster than my Apple AirPort Extreme.    I guess flat configuration will be OK?  Is that any tool can measure network performance issue or QoS issue?  Without managed switch, RK-1 itself still can isolate guest network and place any device in DMZ which is nice  

 

Just don’t know router like mikrotik will have same performance like RK-1?

[msgreenf]

If you're coming from an airport or aren't you flat before anyway?

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk

[eggzlot]

I use a mikrotik.  Performs fine 

[lippavisual]

I don’t find the RK1 to be in the same league as MT, even there $60 hAP AC router.

Anything you could possibly need in a network, is built in to MT.