Cyknight Posted November 19, 2018 Share Posted November 19, 2018 5 hours ago, ntlord said: 1. If C4 would share more of their network requirements, this would be a non-issue. But it’s yet another dealer-model issue. 2. Your average dealer point, is basically the point. I don’t trust many dealers with understanding networking better than me. I’m sure some do, but I bet most don’t. So I’d want full access to the configs. That’s why I’d choose networking equipment that isn’t dealer only. 1. And around and around and around we go. If dealer model is your beef, just say it - don't use it as an argument to avoid proper setup within that model. An argument does not provide a case for itself. 2. And how often do you think I hear that line? The point also isn't that your dealer needs to know MORE about networking. He needs to know that portion of information that is required for the system, so THAT part is what matters. Just because something is dealer setup and installed does/should not mean you do not have full access to it. We do not BLOCK you from doing anything on your networking gear that YOU own. We just note that if you mess it up - that's not covered under any warranty. One does not exclude the other - as a dealer I can setup your network as is appropriate for the system, from there I inform you of any known issues with specialty setups as approriate, and from there you can setup all the other settings as your heart desires. Heck in 'your' case I'd just make sure I have a config backup Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyknight Posted November 19, 2018 Share Posted November 19, 2018 16 hours ago, msgreenf said: Ecobee is a free driver now Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk Right, I keep forgetting that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyknight Posted November 19, 2018 Share Posted November 19, 2018 6 hours ago, msgreenf said: He isn't charging for wiring? That makes no sense Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk Oh he is, just not as a line item. Often this is a way to fully lock in a client vs paying for wiring, then move on to install and final payment (or whatever similar setup is used). Not a fan of the model, but it's not 'wrong' or all that uncommon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msgreenf Posted November 19, 2018 Share Posted November 19, 2018 6 hours ago, Cyknight said: Oh he is, just not as a line item. Often this is a way to fully lock in a client vs paying for wiring, then move on to install and final payment (or whatever similar setup is used). Not a fan of the model, but it's not 'wrong' or all that uncommon. Right, I am with you Cy. And $20 a run is cheap as hell. His cost has to be more that....It's usually almost that much in just quality cables + connectors. Then you factor in time to drill and run cables + finish the cables... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neo1738 Posted November 19, 2018 Author Share Posted November 19, 2018 10 hours ago, msgreenf said: Right, I am with you Cy. And $20 a run is cheap as hell. His cost has to be more that....It's usually almost that much in just quality cables + connectors. Then you factor in time to drill and run cables + finish the cables... This is new construction, not sure if that matters. He said "about $20" so i'm not sure but seemed reasonable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msgreenf Posted November 19, 2018 Share Posted November 19, 2018 29 minutes ago, Neo1738 said: This is new construction, not sure if that matters. He said "about $20" so i'm not sure but seemed reasonable. It's not reasonable to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eggzlot Posted November 19, 2018 Share Posted November 19, 2018 34 minutes ago, Neo1738 said: This is new construction, not sure if that matters. He said "about $20" so i'm not sure but seemed reasonable. yeah its tough to say. in your market what is the going labor rate for an electrician or plumber or whatever. how many lines can they run in 1 hour? even with open framework. There are other costs - he didn't mention a patch panel in the estimate, is that needed? Tons of zip ties or velcro wraps, little labels for the cables, the ends for the cables, etc. The hardware itself yeah its cheap, cable in bulk isnt expensive. Its the time that is expensive based on labor wages. In my neck of the woods (northern NJ) labor rates are between $50-$150/hr depending on the industry and skill of the individual. Even at $50/hr could someone that Jr run more than 2-3 wires, terminate, label etc per hour? and at $20/run that is break even, no profit. Again you have good references you trust, you have a price you like, so you can sleep well at night. That's a good thing :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neo1738 Posted November 19, 2018 Author Share Posted November 19, 2018 labor was quoted $4800. but yeah I am also willing to pay a little over premium for premium service. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eggzlot Posted November 20, 2018 Share Posted November 20, 2018 Well at 20/run and 4800 thats 240 runs again its all baked in which is fine. Enjoy the fun of c4! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AK1 Posted December 30, 2018 Share Posted December 30, 2018 1. Nothing wrong with Unifi network gear BUT it does not play nice with Control4 (that is why it is on Control4's do not use list). I have many clients using the Ubiquiti Wifi product line with ZERO issues. The issues come in primarily with the switches / routers. If you are prepared to spend the time rolling up your sleeves with your dealer to get the right settings in place, it will likely work (billable work). I went through this exercise with a client recently. The SnapAV / Araknis networking gear with possible exception of their WAPs (personal preference) is light years easier to configure, brilliant remote management and totally accessible to a tech-savvy client. The importance of having the dealer install, or at least configure, and therefore trust the network cannot be over-emphasized. This is not to say full control cannot be enabled for the right client. 2. What @Cyknight said about Control4 video matrix. I do think the SnapAV MoiP has big potential but does require a dealer with really good networking knowledge (only a few of those around -)) The importance of good support for video distribution cannot be over-emphasized. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neo1738 Posted December 31, 2018 Author Share Posted December 31, 2018 15 hours ago, AK1 said: 1. Nothing wrong with Unifi network gear BUT it does not play nice with Control4 (that is why it is on Control4's do not use list). I have many clients using the Ubiquiti Wifi product line with ZERO issues. The issues come in primarily with the switches / routers. If you are prepared to spend the time rolling up your sleeves with your dealer to get the right settings in place, it will likely work (billable work). I went through this exercise with a client recently. The SnapAV / Araknis networking gear with possible exception of their WAPs (personal preference) is light years easier to configure, brilliant remote management and totally accessible to a tech-savvy client. The importance of having the dealer install, or at least configure, and therefore trust the network cannot be over-emphasized. This is not to say full control cannot be enabled for the right client. 2. What @Cyknight said about Control4 video matrix. I do think the SnapAV MoiP has big potential but does require a dealer with really good networking knowledge (only a few of those around -)) The importance of good support for video distribution cannot be over-emphasized. Dealer said he called his SnapAV guy who told him their MoiP product isn't good for my job at this time. Recommended we stick with C4. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LollerAgent Posted December 31, 2018 Share Posted December 31, 2018 There are numerous threads here that discuss the limitations of a traditional HDMI matrix.. .like this one: I just don't understand why anyone would install one today - especially with that price tag. I would ask your dealer to look into IP based solutions like JAP. Beyond that, I would generally question why you feel the need to have video distribution in the first place. If you do feel that it's necessary, a system like JAP provides more flexibility and should be able to withstand the times better than a traditional HDMI matrix. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AK1 Posted December 31, 2018 Share Posted December 31, 2018 1 hour ago, LollerAgent said: There are numerous threads here that discuss the limitations of a traditional HDMI matrix.. .like this one: I just don't understand why anyone would install one today - especially with that price tag. I would ask your dealer to look into IP based solutions like JAP. Beyond that, I would generally question why you feel the need to have video distribution in the first place. If you do feel that it's necessary, a system like JAP provides more flexibility and should be able to withstand the times better than a traditional HDMI matrix. JAP and MoIP will price out at very similar levels compared to traditional video matrix. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LollerAgent Posted December 31, 2018 Share Posted December 31, 2018 Yeah - but, hopefully they will be useful for a longer period of time and won't be outdated by obsolete HDMI protocols, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.