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Discussion of new CA-10 controller

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17 minutes ago, eggzlot said:

I am not a hardware expert by any means so I stand to be corrected.

https://smart-story.ru/files/products/controllers/ea-1-performance-comparison-rev-a.pdf

is that Hc-800 a single core?  If so wouldnt a dual core 1.6 be better than a single core 1.8?  Again I dont know, and I am just assuming the HC800 is a single core.  I find it hard to believe they put a worse chip in the EA5 compared to the HC800.

I always find this pdf interesting. If you dont use the AV components, the EA-1 and EA3 have the same processing power and even the EA-5 is just slightly better. For this reason, I just dont see why I would need anything other than an EA-1 right now.

The EA-1 is the best deal out there right now.

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20 minutes ago, Dunamivora said:

I assume the question mark is for why I said the HC800 is better?

It has a faster CPU than the EA5.

 

No it doesn't.

Just because a processor has a higher clockspeed, doesn't mean it's faster.

Add to that the fact that the EA5 has dedicated processors to offload some items (Audio in particular) vs doing it all on the main CPU.

 

EA5 is roughly 2x faster than the HC-800 as per Control4.

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Well, I have ordered a CA10. I have no idea how long it will take to get one to South Africa, but the sooner the better as I am keen to see how it goes.

Also, my project has been a bit unstable for the last month or so (very unstable this week and my dealer has been here most days) and 2 of the theories (mine, dealer and C4 country rep) are that:

1. My EA5 is starting to fail; or

2. My project is too big and is testing the EA5 to its limits.

Either way, a CA10 should fix the issues and this is a great excuse for a new toy.  Of course, if I was a conspiracy theorist, I would say that C4 organized for my system, to become unstable just before launching the solution 🤣.

My house is not massive, around 7,000 square feet but I do have absolutely everything linked to Control4 and my memory usage looks like it sits over 90% all of the time...

 

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HC800: Intel Atom D525 1.8Ghz dual core, 1GB or 2GB of RAM depending on model, All RAm usable.

EA5: Intel Atom CE5335 1.6Ghz dual core, 2GB of RAM, 1.6GB usable

Easy info to find using cpuinfo and top after logging in.

The Audio CPUs are likely used to get the sample rate that's 4 times higher. Audio is definitely better on the EAs, same with the On-Screen nav.

The HC800, however, is better at running projects (director process seems and acts like it needs a single core).

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2 hours ago, eggzlot said:

got it

again no expert but I'd hope the EA5 processor is a more modern/efficient one so the 1.6 vs 1.8 is not really a big deal and furthermore than EA5 has 2x the RAM.  I'd assume its a beefier machine.

pretty sure its 64bit os vs 32 bit os....so big difference there

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1 hour ago, South Africa C4 user said:

my memory usage looks like it sits over 90% all of the time..

i would be more concerned with CPU then memory.  What is your VPU bouncing to?

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As somebody mentioned here, I never understood why it was not possible to have a backup controller to take over automatically if the main controller failed. I have, as main controller, an EA5, but there is also the "old" HC 800 that I kept in the project, mainly for i/o and the zigbee for the remote control (I do not have a zigbeee mesh since all lighting in my home is panelized).

Yesterday night my Intercom was not working well so I rebooted the EA5 by unplugging it (I hate to do this but, as far as I know it is the only way for end users to do it). The EA5 never came back to life and the "Caution Led" (triangle) was blinking red, which according to my dealer means that the "Factory Reset" failed. Strange, since nobody attempted to do a factory reset.

Today morning my dealer came and now yes he tried to make a Factory reset but the same error appeared. So he changed the EA5 and everything worked again.

Having a big project with many lights, security blinds, cameras, Videostorm, 3 alarm panels etc etc. not having the system working is a real headache. So, if Control 4 decided not to implement a backup controller I would surely purchase a CA-10 (In spite of the high price) since I really do not want my system to fail.

Many years ago the PCs sometimes had some problems with the Bios and will not boot up. This problem was solved with the motherboards with Dual Bios and I have never see another PC failed because of this. Being the controller basically a PC with some other features, does someone know if the EA5 has something similar to the Dual Bios (I guess he answer is "no",  due to what just happened to my EA5).

And what about the CA-10; I see that it has redundant power supply, two NICs, two fans, and two SSD where project is stored with mirrored RAID configuration. But what about the firmware of the controller, is it also redundant? 

Thanks in advance for your comments!!

Regards

 

 

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This is another reason i will not put my Alarm system on C4..  I keep it completely separated.. thats the last thing I need is my alarm system to go down..  alarm / Thermostat / Security cameras are all on their own.. I can access c4 and see cameras, but it is more of a novelty than useful..  

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Ferbor, as far as I am aware, there is no way to have a secondary backup controller that automatically kicks on when the primary fails.

It will be interesting to see the CA10, but my initial thought is it doesn't have redundant firmware/backup OS in case the primary OS fails to boot.

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44 minutes ago, CTO said:

This is another reason i will not put my Alarm system on C4..  I keep it completely separated.. thats the last thing I need is my alarm system to go down..  alarm / Thermostat / Security cameras are all on their own.. I can access c4 and see cameras, but it is more of a novelty than useful..  

Why wouldn’t you put your alarm on Control4? The alarm is a different subsystem and can act on its own. I have a Honeywell Vista 20p integrated. If Control4 was to go down, the alarm would still function as is. 

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Just one more thing to worry about.  Just easy to use the alarm as it is.   Same with my thermostat. I added it once with a driver but all the variable speed functions and stuff were not on so I took it off. I just try and use c4 for music and video for TVs and audio zones and some ligHts. Security cameras on its own system, that I can view as a device on a tv, alarm on its own app thermostat on its own and that’s works out good for me

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Plus my wife just figured out how to change from cable box to Apple TV.  That took over a year for her to figure out. Add anything more I’ll be thrown out of the house

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29 minutes ago, Dunamivora said:

but my initial thought is it doesn't have redundant firmware/backup OS in case the primary OS fails to boot.

It has dual storage in redundant/mirror raid with no mention of an additional (hardware) storage for the OS, so I would assume it does (partitioned seperately ont he SSDs). The only thing as far as I can tell is failure of CPU that it wouldn't at least alert you of, and some form of project corruption that takes it down (as a mirrored drive would simply copy the corruption.

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7 hours ago, Dunamivora said:

HC800: Intel Atom D525 1.8Ghz dual core, 1GB or 2GB of RAM depending on model, All RAm usable.

EA5: Intel Atom CE5335 1.6Ghz dual core, 2GB of RAM, 1.6GB usable

Easy info to find using cpuinfo and top after logging in.

So what? CPU frequency and RAM amount are in no way all telling.

RAM clock speed alone on the CE5335 is double that of the D525, unfortunately there are limited spec available on the CE5335 so a full comparison is not truly possible.

7 hours ago, Dunamivora said:

The Audio CPUs are likely used to get the sample rate that's 4 times higher. Audio is definitely better on the EAs, same with the On-Screen nav.

Sure, and to offload the process from the CPU.

Quote

The HC800, however, is better at running projects (director process seems and acts like it needs a single core

Based on what? Certainly not my experience. Quite the opposite in fact.

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7 hours ago, South Africa C4 user said:

Well, I have ordered a CA10. I have no idea how long it will take to get one to South Africa, but the sooner the better as I am keen to see how it goes.

Also, my project has been a bit unstable for the last month or so (very unstable this week and my dealer has been here most days) and 2 of the theories (mine, dealer and C4 country rep) are that:

1. My EA5 is starting to fail; or

2. My project is too big and is testing the EA5 to its limits.

Either way, a CA10 should fix the issues and this is a great excuse for a new toy.  Of course, if I was a conspiracy theorist, I would say that C4 organized for my system, to become unstable just before launching the solution 🤣.

My house is not massive, around 7,000 square feet but I do have absolutely everything linked to Control4 and my memory usage looks like it sits over 90% all of the time...

 

Can you share what all you have that is taxing your system that hard? I have over a hundred lighting devices, 16 zones of audio, JAP Video distribution, 2 AVR's, 8 security cameras, DS2 Mini, motion sensors, thermostats, DMX lighting, tons of drivers, etc... I'm using every I/O on the EA5 AND the HC800 including the contacts and relays. My house is comparable in size to yours. I don't feel like I tax the EA5 at all, so just curious what else might be going on in your place...

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^

^

I would agree - the CA-10 may well help, but it takes a LOT to throw an EA-5 off, it sounds more likely to me that there's a driver (or several) that are causing high memory usage.

My own system is quite a bit more involved than our beloved Village Idiot's is in some ways at least, and I'm still not pushing the EA-5

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11 minutes ago, Cyknight said:

So what? CPU frequency and RAM amount are in no way all telling.

RAM clock speed alone on the CE5335 is double that of the D525, unfortunately there are limited spec available on the CE5335 so a full comparison is not truly possible.

Sure, and to offload the process from the CPU.

Based on what? Certainly not my experience. Quite the opposite in fact.

Cyknight, you should talk to your TFM and ask what they put in on escalations. 😉 HC800 kicks the EA5's ass in large projects. I know first hand.

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1 minute ago, Dunamivora said:

Cyknight, you should talk to your TFM and ask what they put in on escalations. 😉 HC800 kicks the EA5's ass in large projects. I know first hand.

Nah I'm good actually. Of course, as you're the one that started throwing out specs and stating you 'know' these things, you may want to consider following your own advise on that one. 😋

You 'know' first hand something that I 'know' first hand is incorrect. Everyone can make of that what they will.

 

 

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Alright, how about this. Go find a stress test you can run on the two controllers. Load it up and run it command line. The HC800 will end up with a higher score.

I know you don't believe me, but my own home is on an HC800 instead of an EA5 because I liked the snappier response. I tried both an EA5 and an EA3, both were slower at loading the app, selecting sources, and running automation.

I've also seen other systems on EA5s improve with latency after swapping in an HC800. Now those systems will get a CA10 instead. It was a much needed piece of hardware.

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Ferbor, as far as I am aware, there is no way to have a secondary backup controller that automatically kicks on when the primary fails.
It will be interesting to see the CA10, but my initial thought is it doesn't have redundant firmware/backup OS in case the primary OS fails to boot.
Thanks Dunamivora for your comments. Let us see if someone from Control4 can clarify this issue.

Enviado desde mi SM-G975F mediante Tapatalk

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