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Audio Zone Sync Issues - Triad vs. Receivers


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Hi there, I am trying to install a TV zone where sound is powered by an Sony receiver and other bar zones within an open concept space beside it are powered by the C4/Triad system. All components in the rack, and I have a echo effect as they are not synced clearly. I assume there is processing happening in the receiver that is causing this but assume this is a common issue but could not find much on it. Can anyone clarify if this is common or has anyone come up with a solution?

Second to that, I wanted to have the subwoofer from the TV/Receiver also be used when the zone next door is on without the receiver zone being on. Is this possible? Alternatively we could power the sub from the TRIAD amps and have that come on the same time as the TV/Receiver but wasn't sure if there was processing that would be missing going this way?

I welcome any advice,

Charlie

NYC

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Does the Sony Avr have a bypass mode where it doesn’t process audio, like party mode?  How is the Sony receiving the audio: analog, digital or hdmi?

 

AVRs certainly add some delay for processing.  You could always add a separate audio delay unit to each soundbar zone if necessary.

If the sub is connected to the AvR, then the AVR needs to be turned on to receive the audio. No way around that.

C4 amps are not designed to power subs.  

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As Lippa said… You can set your AVR into a direct mode to pass the processor but you will only have the front left/right. Any type of processing (surround or multi-stereo) will delay the signal versus your analog distrusted system.  Otherwise you can attempt to sync manual set delays. 

How many zones are neighboring the AVR zone? I assume they will all be on at the same time at all times? Do you need the surround sound or are you using the AVR mostly for video switching? You could preamp out off an AVR into your distribution but that will be redesigning your system to an extent. 

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13 hours ago, Control4Savant said:

As Lippa said… You can set your AVR into a direct mode to pass the processor but you will only have the front left/right. Any type of processing (surround or multi-stereo) will delay the signal versus your analog distrusted system.  Otherwise you can attempt to sync manual set delays. 

How many zones are neighboring the AVR zone? I assume they will all be on at the same time at all times? Do you need the surround sound or are you using the AVR mostly for video switching? You could preamp out off an AVR into your distribution but that will be redesigning your system to an extent. 

We have tried going "direct" on the AVR and other workarounds. No dice. The AVRs are only used in rooms where there are larger TV's (like a large family room) that is next to a kitchen. The AVRs are needed for surround sound. 

Seems to be such a basic problem and yet there does not seem to be a solution two separate dealers can come up with. How is this possible?

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On 11/24/2021 at 11:00 PM, Charlie Mackenzie said:

Hi there, I am trying to install a TV zone where sound is powered by an Sony receiver and other bar zones within an open concept space beside it are powered by the C4/Triad system. 

 

How are things cabled starting at the source?

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You'd need to run the ZONE 2 analog audio out of the receiver into the matrix as the source for adjacent rooms, thus the Receiver is the switcher for all combo use.

As to the sub, that's more complicated. Most likely going to need some form of an AB switcher. When theater on, signal from receiver, when not, signal from matrix.
 

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11 hours ago, Charlie Mackenzie said:

We have tried going "direct" on the AVR and other workarounds. No dice. The AVRs are only used in rooms where there are larger TV's (like a large family room) that is next to a kitchen. The AVRs are needed for surround sound. 

Seems to be such a basic problem and yet there does not seem to be a solution two separate dealers can come up with. How is this possible?

How is what possible? Are you trying to sync multiple AVRs? Just because you want something doesn’t mean it magically happens. 

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1 hour ago, Control4Savant said:

How is what possible? Are you trying to sync multiple AVRs? Just because you want something doesn’t mean it magically happens. 

How is it possible that what seems to be a common problem does not have a common solution. All I am trying to do is have a receiver that powers a TV zone have the same audio timing as the rest of the control4 triad platform as this TV zone is in an open space with a bunch of other zones. So, in order to not here an echo there needs to be some correction. I think best answer is to put extra speakers in the ceiling that only work with the Triad platform and then just have the receiver as dedicated TV. therefore no delay and no part of the open concept living space without sound. Seems excessive, but it will solve it. Now, we just need to solve the subwoofer issue which is on the receiver but wanted for the audio zones as well. might just look for a sub with two line ins and run one from the matrix to the sub and the other from the AVR to the sub. 

again, my comment was around this is not a unique problem and based on responses to this, it clearly is an ongoing thing. just no clean answer to date. Lots of Band-Aids and trial and error. 

Everyone has been super helpful, really appreciate the feedback. I have tried a few of these suggestions (thank you to the community) but they don't seem to work for my application.

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13 minutes ago, Charlie Mackenzie said:

How is it possible that what seems to be a common problem does not have a common solution. All I am trying to do is have a receiver that powers a TV zone have the same audio timing as the rest of the control4 triad platform as this TV zone is in an open space with a bunch of other zones. So, in order to not here an echo there needs to be some correction. I think best answer is to put extra speakers in the ceiling that only work with the Triad platform and then just have the receiver as dedicated TV. therefore no delay and no part of the open concept living space without sound. Seems excessive, but it will solve it. Now, we just need to solve the subwoofer issue which is on the receiver but wanted for the audio zones as well. might just look for a sub with two line ins and run one from the matrix to the sub and the other from the AVR to the sub. 

again, my comment was around this is not a unique problem and based on responses to this, it clearly is an ongoing thing. just no clean answer to date. Lots of Band-Aids and trial and error. 

Everyone has been super helpful, really appreciate the feedback. I have tried a few of these suggestions (thank you to the community) but they don't seem to work for my application.

We have clean answers you have been given. They involve changing some things, not just swapping to another AVR. You want to have a digital processor on one piece of unrelated hardware work magically with an analog distribution system and that’s not going to happen without redesigning the system as it should have been done or changing the connections of your current hardware. 

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1 hour ago, Control4Savant said:

We have clean answers you have been given. They involve changing some things, not just swapping to another AVR. You want to have a digital processor on one piece of unrelated hardware work magically with an analog distribution system and that’s not going to happen without redesigning the system as it should have been done or changing the connections of your current hardware. 

Apologies if it was not clear above - I have tried many of these things (via the dealer) who also follows this forum now. 

Again, thanks to the community at large. 

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