bebster Posted September 26, 2009 Share Posted September 26, 2009 My swimming pool has a cover, and that cover has a switch that you hold up to close the cover and down to open the cover. That runs over a 3-wire circuit to the bi-directional motor. Probably 15 to 20A wire. I'm trying to figure out a way to monitor that so I know when someone is opening and closing the cover. E.g., if the cover is being opened, I'd like to play a subtle announcement in the house (standard announcement methods for Control4), but I need a trigger.Any ideas? I looked at the TED energy monitors but they look like overkill (this is not a 200A panel, and just need on/off indication). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeNYC Posted September 26, 2009 Share Posted September 26, 2009 Bebster-The Wireless Outlet Switch can monitor when the current changes through the switch, and trigger an event. You don't have to use the C4 wireless switch to actually control the load...you can sense when the load itself changes, if you like (which sounds like what you want).Outlet Switch: Load Ratings (total across both outlets)• 120 VAC, 1000 VA, Inductive, Total • 120 VAC, 1/3 HP (7.2 FLA), Total • 120 VAC, 7.2 A, Ballast, TotalPDF: http://www.jclautomation.com/docs/Control4-Wireless-Outlet-Switch.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jberger Posted September 26, 2009 Share Posted September 26, 2009 The card access high voltage controller would also work and be every easy to integrate. Are you certain that the switch itself is 120v? Most of the covers I've seen are controlled via a low voltage relay since they are in close proximity to the pool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RyanE Posted September 27, 2009 Share Posted September 27, 2009 Another solution would be to put a slave relay into the circuit, it would need to be a 110V coil, with 5v outputs. You could then either run this to your controller, and/or use a CardAccess contact device to send the signal into the Control4 system.RyanE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bebster Posted September 27, 2009 Author Share Posted September 27, 2009 The slave relay approach seems to be the simplest and cheapest. I could run parallel wiring to the switch so that it energizes the relay at the same time as the motor. It sounds like a 5V source that runs through the Normally Open outputs of the relay would then go to a controller of some sort. I'd need a small AC adapter that outputs 5V DC I guess (like is found on many small electronics).Since I want to monitor both the pool cover opening and closing I'd need 2 relays and 2 inputs to a controller of some sort.What are possible controllers with 2 inputs that can sense the presence of 5V DC? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RyanE Posted September 27, 2009 Share Posted September 27, 2009 Could also be 12V DC.If you don't have inputs on a controller (such as an HC500), your cheapest option may be the CardAccess Contact input units. They have 3 contact inputs, 2 wired and 1 magnetic door contact. If your controls are in a 'pool closet', you could mount the CardAccess unit above the door, put a magnetic contact on the door, and also be able to tell when someone opens the pool closet door, on top of the 2 relays.If you went that way, you would probably want to put the contact on a transformer itself anyway, you may be able to use it's voltage to power the relay contacts as inputs, although I don't remember if the CA unit uses a DC transformer or not.RyanE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akg4y Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 If you have a security system could you just put a wireless contact on the cover? I dont know if there are any outdoor contacts or not... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capww8 Posted October 4, 2009 Share Posted October 4, 2009 I'm no sparky... and I've never even looked at a pool cover control... but if you have three wires running from the switch to the pool motor controller it's probably low voltage. High voltage would just give you hot, neutral, and ground... you could energize something down the line, but it wouldn't necessarily know whether you were trying to open or close.With low voltage you would have one common, with one wire to close a relay to open the cover, and one wire to close a relay to close the cover.If this is the case, you could just wire a single card access contact switch in parallel at the pool cover controller to sense whether someone was trying to open or close the cover. Please keep in mind it's still early, and I may not be thinking correctly, but I think this should work. Alternately, you could install a card access wireless relay, replace your existing switch w/ a c4 three button, and have total control over the pool opener:* Only allow opening at certain times* Receive notification if opened* Receive notification if closed* Automatically close at certain times* Automatically close if outside temp drops below a certain threshold etc... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RyanE Posted October 4, 2009 Share Posted October 4, 2009 The ones I've seen are a key switch, so replacing with a Control4 switch, while convenient, does not keep the original intent of security.Of course, all the ones I've seen also *always* have the key in the switch.RyanE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bebster Posted October 4, 2009 Author Share Posted October 4, 2009 That's right, the pool cover switches have a keyed cover (for safety, so you can lock the cover closed), and are 110 volt.They are spring loaded with the center position being neutral (no action). Push the switch up and current goes over one of the lines to the motor that causes it to open the cover. Push the switch down and current flows over the other line to the motor causing it to close the cover. If you let go of the switch, it springs back to neutral and the motor stops (again for safety). Since someone could be trapped under the cover and drown, the switch must be in plain view of the pool.Here's how I think it is wired: http://www.leviton.com/OA_HTML/ibcGetAttachment.jsp?cItemId=kcn5mZzJPSrJPg3tK6YgXQ&label=IBE&appName=IBESo far, it looks like adding 2 relays into the mix as Ryan suggests will create the 2 events, e.g., cover_opening and cover_closing).That creates a programming challenge next.For example, if someone closes the cover and quickly pushes the switch to the open and then releases it, the motor doesn't have time to really move the cover, but the least event was "cover_opening". But the cover remains closed. I think I'd need to set 2 timer variables to measure the duration of each event, and infer the state of the cover from those durations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RyanE Posted October 4, 2009 Share Posted October 4, 2009 The only completely 'safe' solution would be to install a switch that is triggered when the pool cover is completely closed.Whether that's possible or not would depend on the design of the cover and it's motorization system.RyanE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capww8 Posted October 5, 2009 Share Posted October 5, 2009 Thanks for the clarification... not too many pool covers 'round these parts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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