me23 Posted April 17, 2012 Share Posted April 17, 2012 Ok, my pre-wire is almost done and I will have 3 cat6 going to each tv location. My wire guy is coming back Friday and was asking if I wanted the cat6 connected to a wall plate or not. I plan on using a hdmi matrix obviously, probably the atlona 8x8, and was wondering if I should run the cat6 straight into the atlona receiver then to the tv or connect a patch cable to the plate, to the receiver, then to the tv? Per atlona manual."Avoid using patch panels and wall plates during initial set up and testing of the matrix switcher." Initial setup?, why does that matter? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C4RVA Posted April 17, 2012 Share Posted April 17, 2012 My thought is that you want to verify the matrix switch is working properly before introducing possible connections that could be improperly terminated and cause troubleshooting headaches. I would have the wire guy terminate to a wall plate and patch panels but try to leave a service loop big enough that your installer or you can re do the termination in case there is an error or interference. Not sure why the specifically mention not to do that. Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ichbinbose Posted April 17, 2012 Share Posted April 17, 2012 skip the wall plate and patch panel's. You want the cable to go from point A to point B with nothing to potentially interfer with the signal. HDMI has enough issues to overcome. Don't add additional pitfalls. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neter66 Posted April 17, 2012 Share Posted April 17, 2012 skip the wall plate and patch panel's. You want the cable to go from point A to point B with nothing to potentially interfer with the signal. HDMI has enough issues to overcome.I respectfully disagree. Cat6 should be punched down, and not terminated via a plug. Patch cables (certified) are cheap. There is no excuse not to use a patch cable and a punched down termination. Debugging a hand crimped connection can be a PITA.Additionally, if you are looking to certify your installation - as it may be necessary per your local building code and insurance requirements - I was under the impression that the plug component had to be molded ( ie: inject a resin after being crimped ) I have not met a low voltage installer that uses their own resin. They punch down at the panel and wall, and then use certified patch cables between devices. Yes, it's more connections (which one would logically want to eliminate) however, it's more proper to punch down and patch. If certification and insurance requirements are a non-issue though, either will work. I can say, in my installation ( close to 100 drops ) I wish I would have terminated all this way. I have some that are punched down, and some that are just terminated with a plug. If I could do over, all would be punched. ThanksD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ichbinbose Posted April 17, 2012 Share Posted April 17, 2012 punched down looks nicer for sure. However when it comes to video distribution over cat, its not the same as a network. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CFUG Posted April 17, 2012 Share Posted April 17, 2012 Cert aside, a direct run sounds reasonable as a dedicated converter run(s). You do the wall jacks and guess what, someone later on is going to try to plug their computer into that. Not that the purpose couldn't change but I think you can see where I'm going.Also, what do you mean by "hand crimping" can be a PITA?? I use a $150 tool whether it's a recept. or plug- both could be suspect if not done properly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ILoveC4 Posted April 17, 2012 Share Posted April 17, 2012 I use a $150 tool whether it's a recept. or plug- both could be suspect if not done properly.I agree with that point. In my experience, I would imagine I would make more mistakes punching down to the keystone than putting the RJ45 on. Much more tedious process in my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CFUG Posted April 17, 2012 Share Posted April 17, 2012 True, in my "vast" experience with AV installs (cough cough), I've had to go back on the couplers far more than on the plugs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neter66 Posted April 17, 2012 Share Posted April 17, 2012 Cert aside, a direct run sounds reasonable as a dedicated converter run(s). You do the wall jacks and guess what, someone later on is going to try to plug their computer into that. Not that the purpose couldn't change but I think you can see where I'm going.That's exactly why you'd want it on the panel. Because someone may want to plug a computer into it in the future. As long as it's patched correctly in wiring rack, you have future proofed it.I think my point on the cert tho can't be so quickly dismissed. There are jurisdictions that require low voltage installers to be licensed. Insurance company/building inspector will want a letter to prove installation is as per spec. With cat6, this means printed test reports, which certifies the install. So, although it sounds easy to just say 'cert aside' there may be legal requirements that say this isn't the case... Also, what do you mean by "hand crimping" can be a PITA?? I use a $150 tool whether it's a recept. or plug- both could be suspect if not done properly.I use $150 tools as well. If punching down and using a proper cat6 block and a proper punchdown tool, the jack is going to have a cleaner connection to the wire. Close to 180 degrees of contact is made to the outside of the copper wire. If using a plug, and piercing the jacket of the wire, contact between connector and the wire will be significantly less than 180 degrees, and may actually pierce the wire itself (assuming solid core) and therefore connectivity is only as good as the span of the connector. As electrons travel on the outside of the wire, it is therefore logical that the more contact you have you have to the outside of the wire, the better connection you are going to have.Plus, when using a plug, the movement of the plug end can cause failure. When a wire is terminated in a receptacle, and a zip tie is used on the tail end, movement is close to zero. I've had hand made cables work great for years, and then just die. I've cannot say the same for receptacles. Your milage may very though... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CFUG Posted April 17, 2012 Share Posted April 17, 2012 My jurisdiction does not care about low voltage- building inspector, insurance or Fire, none of them recognize this. As far as the other issue, it's up to the OP. I haven't seen what a bank of 4 ethernet ports on a plate looks like on a wall but I have seen single and double-gang hoods carrying multiple coax or Ethernet runs directly to devices. I have little idea what you are trying to say regarding the install of a plug. The conductors are most definitely at 180 wrt the blade. Just so I'm straight on this, what are suggesting to use for a plug-end? I know what you are using for jack- same as everyone else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
me23 Posted April 17, 2012 Author Share Posted April 17, 2012 Thanks for the responses guys. Hmm, so far sounds like opinion is split on this. I'm starting to lean towards using a wall plate and leaving enough cable to convert to a direct run if needed.Anyone else care to respond and voice some opinion and experience on this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ILoveC4 Posted April 17, 2012 Share Posted April 17, 2012 Thanks for the responses guys. Hmm, so far sounds like opinion is split on this. I'm starting to lean towards using a wall plate and leaving enough cable to convert to a direct run if needed.Anyone else care to respond and voice some opinion and experience on this?If he's willing to put in the keystone and wall plate no charge you might as well have him do it. It's easy to undo that...just takes a screwdriver, a pair of cutters and about 15 seconds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
me23 Posted April 18, 2012 Author Share Posted April 18, 2012 Yep, I agree. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ichbinbose Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 a lot of the balum manufactures recomend NOT using keystones in the path, or anything else other, than wire and RJ45 connectors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AceOfSpades Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 skip the wall plate and patch panel's. You want the cable to go from point A to point B with nothing to potentially interfer with the signal. HDMI has enough issues to overcome.I respectfully disagree. Cat6 should be punched down' date=' and not terminated via a plug. Patch cables (certified) are cheap. There is no excuse not to use a patch cable and a punched down termination. Debugging a hand crimped connection can be a PITA.Additionally, if you are looking to certify your installation - as it may be necessary per your local building code and insurance requirements - I was under the impression that the plug component had to be molded ( ie: inject a resin after being crimped ) I have not met a low voltage installer that uses their own resin. They punch down at the panel and wall, and then use certified patch cables between devices. Yes, it's more connections (which one would logically want to eliminate) however, it's more proper to punch down and patch. If certification and insurance requirements are a non-issue though, either will work. I can say, in my installation ( close to 100 drops ) I wish I would have terminated all this way. I have some that are punched down, and some that are just terminated with a plug. If I could do over, all would be punched. ThanksD.[/quote']+1 I have Cat 6 STP and terminating those directly is a Biatch!!! Plus it doesn't look as good IMHO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samsong Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 I would have gone with 4 cat6 cables. Depending on the Baluns your using, they may require 2 cat6. 1 for your IR and then if you want to include internet ? Or future needs ?Just my opinion.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CFUG Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 a lot of the balum manufactures recomend NOT using keystones in the path, or anything else other, than wire and RJ45 connectors.Of course. Why would they want to fold that potential fault into the functional guarantee. I would go this way irrespective of any mumble-jumble. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
me23 Posted April 18, 2012 Author Share Posted April 18, 2012 I would have gone with 4 cat6 cables. Depending on the Baluns your using, they may require 2 cat6. 1 for your IR and then if you want to include internet ? Or future needs ?Just my opinion..The atlona just requires one, but I do see your point. I might see if he can add an extra one, shouldnt be a problem.I'll tell ya, I'm kind of torn on what to do here. Maybe I will just do a wall plate and leave one cat 6 terminated rj45 and plug that in to the balun.Shit, I dont know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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