Another lighting thread

[nate4AU]

Hi all! I have an EA-3 running thermostats and various audio/video for 8 zones. I’m trying to figure out what kind of project and expense I’d be undertaking if I wanted to add some simple light controls. Everything is wired to traditional switches, and this would be a retrofit. Most, but not all of our zones have C4-KC120277 wireless configurable keypads installed above the traditional light switches. Those keypads are configured for A/V volume and for switching between audio/video sources, but to be honest, we rarely use anything other than the volume and “off” button. I could likely have those reconfigured, if necessary.

So, in general, what would it take to get some basic C4 light controls? As an example, there are 18 seven-watt LED can lights in the ceiling of our den. They are currently on a 4-way switch. Three of those are simple on/off and the fourth is a toggle dimmer. Only one of the light switches (the dimmer) gets used. If it’s possible, I’d have no issues with leaving the three on/off toggles in place, and simply replacing the existing dimmer switch with something controlled by the C4 system. Not sure if that’s possible, however. I do want to use C4 equipment.

I’d really like to have a basic understanding and design before I got to my dealer. He is an old friend that has since moved across the country and mostly shut down his C4 business. He still does the occasional remote update for me (e.g. I’m now on OS3), and can source equipment. But, I also feel bad about asking him to do “too much”. He’s giving to a fault. I’d like to figure out as much of this as possible on my own, to take the load off of him. He’s one of those guys that will insist on bending over backwards to help me, even to his own detriment. And then he’ll refuse accept reasonable compensation Not to mention, I just like learning new things and understanding my own system. Thanks in advance!

 

PS - how do I go about getting engraved buttons for the keypads? Is that something I get from my dealer?

[RAV]

You replace your desired switches with Control4 switches.

If it's a 3 or 4 way, you have to replace all associated switches to that load, one is the master which has the feed and load, the others are called Aux keypads, and communicate with the master.

Since you have wireless keypads, I'll assume you have zigbee coverage and not go there.

There are 2 lines of Control4 wireless lighting. The new essentials line, and the previous doesn't really have a name line. They function similarly, but have differences in cosmetics, and features. Essentials is cheaper, no matching keypads, no engravings, less feedback features, less models; a switch and a forward phase dimmer. In addition to switch and dimmer, the standard line has adaptive dimmers, 0-10 dimmers, keypads, and keypad dimmers. Your keypads are from the standard line. You can mix, it's about cosmetics.

Dealers order engravings.

[nate4AU]

Thanks. This gives me an idea of how many switches will need replacing before I take the idea to my dealer. 

Follow-up (stupid) question: so what happens to all these automated lights if the system goes down for some reason? Do you lose the ability to turn on your lights until the problem gets fixed? My wife really loves our home automation WHEN IT WORKS. But on the rare events that it's down, she loses her patience quite quickly  

[Control4Savant]

4 hours ago, nate4AU said:

Thanks. This gives me an idea of how many switches will need replacing before I take the idea to my dealer. 

Follow-up (stupid) question: so what happens to all these automated lights if the system goes down for some reason? Do you lose the ability to turn on your lights until the problem gets fixed? My wife really loves our home automation WHEN IT WORKS. But on the rare events that it's down, she loses her patience quite quickly  

Yes, they will work. Even "centralized" lighting should have this failsafe. The only exception should be is if defective or disabled in composer. 

[tdougray]

11 hours ago, nate4AU said:

Follow-up (stupid) question: so what happens to all these automated lights if the system goes down for some reason? Do you lose the ability to turn on your lights until the problem gets fixed?

On the wireless front I believe the main dimmer connected to the load will work just as a dumb dimmer even without c4 (bloody expensive dumb dimmer mind ) but all keypads/ programming associated will not work until fixed. 

[msgreenf]

2 hours ago, tdougray said:

On the wireless front I believe the main dimmer connected to the load will work just as a dumb dimmer even without c4 (bloody expensive dumb dimmer mind ) but all keypads/ programming associated will not work until fixed. 

nope, if use theauxiliaryy switches not keypads in the other parts of a 4-way or 3-way everything still works. 

[tdougray]

16 minutes ago, msgreenf said:

nope, if use theauxiliaryy switches not keypads in the other parts of a 4-way or 3-way everything still works

Oh my mistake Mitch, I didn’t think keypads would work unless a project was up and running.

[msgreenf]

Oh my mistake Mitch, I didn’t think keypads would work unless a project was up and running.

Correct keypads won't. But auxiliary switches are not keypads

[tdougray]

Ignore Mitch, just re-read your post

[RAV]

Control4 switches and even keypad dimmers, work right out of the box for the dumb switch they are replacing. You can swap all your dumb switches, not ID into Control4 for months and they'll still work their individual wired lights.

Keypad dimmers even have the option in programing to set one of their buttons to still always control the actual load it's installed on. Aliens steal the processor the selected button will still control the light that's physically wired to the keypad dimmer via the preselected button. Any other buttons that are programmed in software though, will not function if there's a processor issue, but non keypad units and the button on the keypad dimmer unit's that set for the load, will all still work.

With centralized lighting, there are options depending on the keypads used, the bus keypads have backup settings, and you can wire a mechanical switch to the module, and there's buttons on the module.

Properly designed and programmed, a houses lights should all still work as dumb switches with just the loss of convenience of keypad buttons, scenes, and other automation. We always take that approach, and never had an issue or freaked out call that can't operate their lights.

[Control4Savant]

Also... remember auxiliary switches have no intelligence to them so you never add them to the project or "ID" them