csmpez Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 Good afternoon everyone... I'm in the process of upgrading our existing TVs in our home and wanted to know if anyone has had any success with 4K distribution or suggestions for HDBaseT baluns (cat5-e to HDMI) that will distribute up to 4K content. I read the HDBaseT thread, which was very informative and seems many like the Wyrestorm baluns. I'm considering purchasing some 4K TVs (Sony) that will come with their 4K media player and if this is possible using the baluns, I'll get the Sony TV. But if not, I'll just get the standard 1080p TVs to replace our older 720p/1080i TVs. Thanks! Scott Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ILoveC4 Posted June 4, 2014 Share Posted June 4, 2014 Me personally? I'd save the $$$ and buy 1080p TV's. Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qVAMPIREp Posted June 4, 2014 Share Posted June 4, 2014 ^ What he said... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
csmpez Posted June 4, 2014 Author Share Posted June 4, 2014 Thanks for the information. This is very interesting. I was tossed between the Sony 65" XBR65X900A, which I can get right now for $2750 shipped for free (no sales tax) or just getting a Samsung 75" UN75F6300 (2013 model) that I can get for $1999 at a local big box store with a 4-year extended warranty for $99. I wasn't too crazy about touching Samsung's 2014 models since they are having a great deal of problems with their firmware. The TV would be replacing an 8 year old 55" Hitachi plasma 720p/1080i TV in our family room. I guess I'll just get the Samsung for now given the good deal I can get on it. Thanks again!!! Scott Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
budd1e_lee Posted June 4, 2014 Share Posted June 4, 2014 I'm not sure what 4k video you're planning to distribute... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
csmpez Posted June 4, 2014 Author Share Posted June 4, 2014 I'm not sure what 4k video you're planning to distribute... Sony has a 4K media player that comes with the 900A and Netflix is releasing 4K content. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
budd1e_lee Posted June 4, 2014 Share Posted June 4, 2014 Sony has a 4K media player that comes with the 900A and Netflix is releasing 4K content. Netflix 4k content is limited to specific 4k TV's, meaning it is in the smart features of the TV, not a source you can distribute. The Sony and Samsung boxes work only with specific models, and state that they require a direct connection to the TV. I know for sure the Sony box is controlled via an App on the TV, not directly via remote so that immediately presents some issues with distribution. Again, there is no 4k content that you could be putting into a distribution system, and there wont be soon. Here is a good read on the proprietary nature of the 4k content at current. http://www.cnet.com/news/why-are-sony-and-samsung-keeping-4k-content-to-themselves/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mstafford388 Posted June 4, 2014 Share Posted June 4, 2014 Better make sure your network in order when 4k netflix becomes a reality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turls Posted June 4, 2014 Share Posted June 4, 2014 The other thing you have to worry about is HDCP 2.2 with the Sony boxes and likely many other 4k sources. That is going to be a challenge for centralized distribution. And I've got the 4K Sony "puck" and the content is underwhelming. Maybe it will get better and maybe streaming will be worth it but I will concentrate on 4K in one room for now. And I want to pay a lot closer to what 2K streaming is for the device, not 5-8 times more. Although actually the new 4K streamer from Sony will support Netflix, but it isn't even released yet. You don't have to have it built into the TV. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
budd1e_lee Posted June 4, 2014 Share Posted June 4, 2014 Although actually the new 4K streamer from Sony will support Netflix, but it isn't even released yet. You don't have to have it built into the TV. One product that is currently a pre-order item and doesn't even work with all of their own branded 4k product isn't something I would be designing a solution around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turls Posted June 4, 2014 Share Posted June 4, 2014 What doesn't it work with? Sony did an upgrade program for the 1000ES projector and everybody had a good option to get that upgraded to something that is functionally and hardware equivalent to a 1100ES. I think they offered free upgrades for everything else. I may be wrong but at least Sony is trying to keep their 4K products from becoming obsolete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyknight Posted June 4, 2014 Share Posted June 4, 2014 Sony so far at least seems to do better, samsung has a (paid!) 1 year upgrade 'kit' and LG is remaining silent last I heard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
csmpez Posted June 4, 2014 Author Share Posted June 4, 2014 Great info, thanks! Well, my wife likes the Sony 65" XBR900A, I'm partial to the Samsung 75" F6300. I actually found an open box one today (display) for $1800. I may just get that one and call it a day. The Wyrestorm baluns I'll be using are the HDBaseT lite 70M model...this should work well to at least get decent 1080p to the TV. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoGo Delicious Posted June 4, 2014 Share Posted June 4, 2014 I have been thinking about 4K and what will be involved in the transition. For me I'm at the opposite end. I have TRUE 4K content, 4096p, but can not find a 4096p display and the fact Kaleidescpe is not 4K capable yet keeps me from moving to 4K. To set the record straight, 4K is NOT the same UHD. Think back to manufactures who labeled their displays HD Ready and they were only 720p. What happened when 1080p came out? At best 4K displays are actually 3K displays (3840 x 2160). Current UHD displays are rated at 3840x2160 max. In a year or so you will see native 4K or TRUE 4K (4096x2160) displays hitting the market. Just like 1080p displays the content will follow the display. Remember when 1080p displays started coming out, naysayers complained about the lack of content. 4K content WILL come and it will NOT be proprietary like Sony and Samsung. Here is a good article in regards to UHD and 4K. As far as distribution goes, I have harped for the last 7-10 years about pulling fiber (You can search these forums and see my post dating back to 2006/2007 about pulling fiber). I even stated "pull fiber along side your CAT5/6 cable and leave it un-terminated so you are ready for 4K." The additional cost of pulling and leaving un-termitaed fiber is minuscule. I installed fiber in my home back in 2005 or 2006 I cannot remember the exact year and with that fiber I can take 4K (4096) video up to 12 miles if need be. My longest run is approx. 400'. With Cat5e you can only get about 165' @ 4096p. The point is those in the AV field NEED to get away from CAT5/6, baluns, extenders, etc and move to fiber IF you are doing a distributed system. I would say since @ LEAST 2010, maybe even earlier, we have not done ANY copper only fiber. Not just for distance but for the data rate. HDBaseT/Copper will only get you so far. Just my 2 cents. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoGo Delicious Posted June 5, 2014 Share Posted June 5, 2014 There is not a 4096p content. I believe you are trying to say "There is no 4096p content". If you so, you are correct. I used the term 4096p to differentiate between 3840x2160 and 4096x2160 displays which was incorrect on my part. If I used 2160p no one would understand what I was actually talking about. To be correct I should have used 3840 and 4096 without the "p" when differentiate between teh 2 displays. The content I do have is 4096x2160. I am under the impression that those on here understand that 4096x2160 is a DCI format,Digital Cinema Initiatives. When I mention I have 4096 (no p) content I am reffering to the DCI standard of 4096x2160. At best 4K displays are actually 3K displays (3840 x 2160). Current UHD displays are rated at 3840x2160 max. Your statement is incorrect! I am not talking technical specs here. I am talking PURELY marketing (think sarcasm). UDH is defined as ANY display that has one digital input and can display video at a minumum of 3840x2160. Again this is just CEA marketing. We know that 4k is 4x as many pixels as 1080p. In a year or so you will see native 4K or TRUE 4K (4096x2160) 2160p displays hitting the market. Just like 1080p displays the content will follow the display.You quoted me incorrectly. I stated "In a year or so you will see native 4K or TRUE 4K (4096x2160) displays hitting the market." That standard is from Digital Cinema Initiatives (DCI). and it is primary market is for film makers. That standard was finalized in 2005. Yes, there are DCI certified displays, but it is primary monitors. TV Logic had 4096 x 2160 monitors back in 2011. Who was the first 4k monitor? IBM T220 (3840×2400) and it was made in 2001. Currently there are no displays, 55" or greater, on the market that can present native 4096x2160 content that I am aware of. I am not looking for a small 30" I am talking 55" MINIMUM. Again, I didn't feel the need to specify 55" in my original post since the OP and others in this thread were talking about larger displays.The term 4K has become generic consumer name for UHD which is technically incorrect. Consumer 4K differs from industry standard 4K (think DCI here). What I was trying to state in my original post, with out all the geeky/nerd speak, is that 4096x2160 displays 55" and >will be coming out within a year or so with native 4096x2160 content following. Maybe I dumbed it down a little to much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turls Posted June 5, 2014 Share Posted June 5, 2014 Currently there are no displays, 55" or greater, on the market that can present native 4096x2160 content that I am aware of. I am not looking for a small 30" I am talking 55" MINIMUM. Again, I didn't feel the need to specify 55" in my original post since the OP and others in this thread were talking about larger displays. Sony 4K projector out over 2 years is true 4K 4096x2160 (no not a display but but much bigger than 55"), but I question how much of a standard that will become when that is a ~1.9 ratio. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LSDave Posted June 6, 2014 Share Posted June 6, 2014 Better make sure your network in order when 4k netflix becomes a reality. Our Samsung rep was streaming 4k netflix(house of cards) over a hotspot from his note3 phone using LTE. You only need about 25mbps to stream 4K30fps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
budd1e_lee Posted June 8, 2014 Share Posted June 8, 2014 LTE is faster than many peoples broadband connection here in Portland. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
budd1e_lee Posted June 9, 2014 Share Posted June 9, 2014 One can only hope! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wappinghigh Posted November 9, 2014 Share Posted November 9, 2014 James (GG'dl) is 100% correct. The industry is full of c*&*&$$p Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wappinghigh Posted November 9, 2014 Share Posted November 9, 2014 I'm not sure what 4k video you're planning to distribute...Haven't the studios been filming for ages using true 4K 4096p cameras? They won't be able to help themselves as the inevitable current BluRay 1080p dies off (like every other disc format before it..... ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyknight Posted November 9, 2014 Share Posted November 9, 2014 Haven't the studios been filming for ages using true 4K 4096p cameras? They won't be able to help themselves as the inevitable current BluRay 1080p dies off (like every other disc format before it..... ) No they've been mainly recording on film - you calculate the amount on a single frame width x height x (size of the appropriate molecule) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wappinghigh Posted November 9, 2014 Share Posted November 9, 2014 Ok.. but the movie projectors you see in a cinema are 4096p digital right?? I mean they still aren't receiving their content on film surely?? Confused... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyknight Posted November 9, 2014 Share Posted November 9, 2014 That would depend, some ondeed do - but you asked for what they've been recording in, not what they're showing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dogdvr Posted November 10, 2014 Share Posted November 10, 2014 Most theaters in USA are 2k, Sony owns some, Mostly in NY and Los Angeles that are 4k. Since most movies have been "filmed" and there is no such thing as pixel density on Film cyknight is right, it could be considered infinite. Depending on the desire of the studio, movies have been converted to digital recently to save the movies. Film was not designed to last 100 plus years. They scan the movies based upon their criteria. that criteria will have some scanned at 2k, 4k and the best right now are being scanned at 8k (think Lawrence of Arabia) You have to remember that not every Album or Movie was created during the time we have had digital formats. In fact the majority of music and movies were created on Analog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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