qVAMPIREp Posted November 29, 2014 Share Posted November 29, 2014 http://www.cepro.com/article/how_much_did_control4_pay_for_extra_vegetables/So EV is 25% of net income yet they only grew by 16% despite the acquisition.... Hmmmmmmm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ILoveC4 Posted November 29, 2014 Share Posted November 29, 2014 Wow. EV was doing way more business than I ever imagined. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wappinghigh Posted November 29, 2014 Share Posted November 29, 2014 I tried to "like" this (both of these comments).... Yes. They got EV very cheaply: but I think Vamps point being it hasn't been synergistic to sales of other gear?? Maybe we need a little more time to tell? I make it the EV net income would be 10% of C4 net revenue?? 460K of income for 850K.. that's one heck of a purchase!!!! .. why did EV sell out?? But 16% growth is too slow.. even with the EV purchase.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ILoveC4 Posted November 29, 2014 Share Posted November 29, 2014 I'm sure EV saw the writing on the wall. "Take this deal, or we'll just develop the same drivers in house and provide them free of charge.". I'd imagine it went something like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wappinghigh Posted November 29, 2014 Share Posted November 29, 2014 Thing is these numbers are still Tiny. No wait. They are Miniscule. We all hang around here.. Luving this product. Yet nobody is listening. We are like that Rosetta Spaceprobe landing on that comet. Trying to tell the world.. A tiny spacecraft (C4 forums) on a slightly bigger object (C4 the comet) circulating in a small solar system(Home Auto)... in a galaxy (world of Apple)... in the milky way. (computers).... in the universe (other electronic components)... And nobody seems to care... But things seem more stable now. This is good. Maybe that's just going to be the lot of C4 in this world. Time will tell I guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wappinghigh Posted November 29, 2014 Share Posted November 29, 2014 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qVAMPIREp Posted November 29, 2014 Author Share Posted November 29, 2014 It's a fugly looking chart... The stock has been getting "beaten like a redheaded stepchild" by investors over the last year despite strong gains in Tech, they have not participated in the rally. Wap you are right about how minuscule C4's earnings are, heck there are probably less than the weekly coffee budget for the big guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wappinghigh Posted November 29, 2014 Share Posted November 29, 2014 It's a fugly looking chart... The stock has been getting "beaten like a redheaded stepchild" by investors over the last year despite strong gains in Tech, they have not participated in the rally. Wap you are right about how minuscule C4's earnings are, heck there are probably less than the weekly coffee budget for the big guys.Yes. This is not a chart of a high growth tech stock. People around here need to ask themselves "why?".... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c4user3622 Posted November 29, 2014 Share Posted November 29, 2014 They are stuck in a rut. Need a new idea to expand the market. Waiting to get bought out is like waiting for the lottery ticket to hit....Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wappinghigh Posted November 29, 2014 Share Posted November 29, 2014 They are stuck in a rut. Need a new idea to expand the market. Waiting to get bought out is like waiting for the lottery ticket to hit....Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkLol and that "new idea" would be???? It's not a new idea! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c4user3622 Posted November 30, 2014 Share Posted November 30, 2014 My first idea would be to make dealers more responsive. I asked mine to renew my remote access subscription a month ago and he had not done it yet....Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qVAMPIREp Posted November 30, 2014 Author Share Posted November 30, 2014 My first idea would be to make dealers more responsive. I asked mine to renew my remote access subscription a month ago and he had not done it yet....Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkIt's impossible to make the dealers more responsive. The dealer model for HA is an epic fail on all levels. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c4user3622 Posted November 30, 2014 Share Posted November 30, 2014 I don't know that the lack of responsiveness is that they are busy. I think it is more about giving them the feeling they are in control and can charge for the privilege of doing what we need.Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qVAMPIREp Posted November 30, 2014 Author Share Posted November 30, 2014 I don't know that the lack of responsiveness is that they are busy. I think it is more about giving them the feeling they are in control and can charge for the privilege of doing what we need.Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkCertain dealers will definitely pull that stunt... Most are pretty good but it's an impossible task. A dealer can only service a limited amount of clients. I'd rather have them designing and installing systems instead of doing updates, minor programming, hardware additions and renewing subscriptions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c4user3622 Posted November 30, 2014 Share Posted November 30, 2014 That is the point isn't it. Their model makes it such that the dealers have to do everything - but they don't seem to want to give that control up and the company doesn't seem to want to loosen the access. So we can all keep going around in circles about how the product is great but it is not for people like us who love technology and want more control. This system is really for people who have small to medium systems who can afford to have dealers be in their house every week. That is obviously what the dealers and the company want - big fish that spend money constantly. Not people like me who want more access.Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SMHarman Posted November 30, 2014 Share Posted November 30, 2014 I believe most spec the system they want and have it built. Not tinker weekly. Bit like building a house. You don't add a room weekly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wappinghigh Posted November 30, 2014 Share Posted November 30, 2014 I believe most spec the system they want and have it built. Not tinker weekly.Bit like building a house. You don't add a room weekly. Philosophically I think this is the sticking point. It's how you visualise the product: Either as a set and forget appliance Or as a dynamic tech story.. I think this is the issue. It's only taken me 5 years to realise it.. LOL As an "appliance" I'm at peace with Control4. It's great as an appliance. The dealer model works well with it as "an appliance". Heck the 16 % growth is at an "appliance like" pace... It's only when some of us users dream of the products potential that I think a bit of disappointment can set in with the current arrangements... But I want that washing machine to fly. Fly baby fly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wappinghigh Posted November 30, 2014 Share Posted November 30, 2014 Certain dealers will definitely pull that stunt... Most are pretty good but it's an impossible task. A dealer can only service a limited amount of clients. I'd rather have them designing and installing systems instead of doing updates, minor programming, hardware additions and renewing subscriptions.Yep. This must be limiting growth..just a little?? surely..?? I mean whatever you think about the current model... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turls Posted December 2, 2014 Share Posted December 2, 2014 My first idea would be to make dealers more responsive. I asked mine to renew my remote access subscription a month ago and he had not done it yet....Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Is this a dealer that has support staff? I don't think most dealers with proper support staff waste time on this stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kemik Posted December 2, 2014 Share Posted December 2, 2014 You could analyse this for hours upon end but here's my 2p worth Companies grow either organically or inorganically For technology companies to grow organically one of the main things they need to do is innovate, bring out new exciting products, etc or inorganically via acquisitions which are done for a multitude of reasons such as to gain key personnel, additional products, key IP/patents, etc to then build into existing product lines, increase revenue/margins and so on Control4 are having a rough ride on the market because they're not innovating...remember that's different than having products that just work I'm not saying they don't....but where is the innovation....I would be amazed if one of the top 2-3 things keeping the CEO of Control4 awake wasn't innovation. Plus their acquisitions have been defensive as opposed to offensively taking on the market. C4 acquire Cardshare and EV...with all due respect not ground breaking or even really newsworthy but just bolstering the products neither of which brought anything new to the party. If anything buying them before a competitor bought them so nothing ground breaking or positive share price impacting. EV did of course reduce the cost of solutions to consumers with is a positive but its not a massive plus point unfortunately Yet all around them companies are innovating in this space....kickstarter is full of IoT ideas, Google are snapping up companies and even NEST smoke and carbon detectors for god's sake seem to be more note worthy than anything C4 has done since listing on the market, all around C4 people are doing things and more importantly better at marketing - in some cases polishing turds better - than C4 I'm afraid Also from a dealers perspective and I'd love to get other opinions other than some very good certification training I struggle to see what else I get as a dealer. Even worse when I've discussed what I think are innovation ideas to help dealers they're not interested.....and that's a MASSIVE issue. Control4 is meant to be a 100% channel lead/delivered solution and if you're not supporting your channel what hope in hell have you got?! Oh well I better stop now as i don't want this to be an uber negative or face palming for C4 but I'm afraid that the reality as I see it unless - and I'm all ears - anyone else has a violently differing opinion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bsanf3 Posted December 3, 2014 Share Posted December 3, 2014 My first idea would be to make dealers more responsive. I asked mine to renew my remote access subscription a month ago and he had not done it yet....Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkIts been "months" for me, I will be looking for a new dealer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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