Video Distribution

[C4CPA]

What is the general feeling among everyone on the forum regarding centralized vs. non centralized video system? What are the benefits and drawbacks of each? The centralized system defiantly costs more, but it also allows for watching any source on any TV. But if I only watch cable TV in various rooms and movies on one room do I really need to spend the money to install a centralized video distribution system?

[Rsmolo]

Its hard to say, it's nice to have just 3 cable boxes ( #of users parents, kids etc.) for 7 or 8 tv's instead of 8 cable boxes and 8 controllers.

I like clean look with only tv on the wall. We always have to install some local dvd's or game systems.

Even for smaller set ups with 3 or 4 tv's I would go central location, but it all comes down to customers budget. He tells you his budget and you tell him what can be done.

I just finished a job where customer's last problem was money but he figured that he wants to spent $15,000 for everything.

First day of retrofitting, cutting his brand new house, he decided to spend extra 5000 for extra wireing just so he doesn't have to cut again. after a week we added another 5000 to install ip cameras all around the house, next will be thermostat and more dimmers.

Like I said if you customer wants to spend 5000 for everything you will not try to sell him central rack solution that will run 20,000

[mercedes]

I love my centralized video system. I have 3 cable/hd boxes one of which is a dvr, my Sony 777es disk changer, one of my controllers providing navigator on the switch for my less used locations, and the new Sony BluRay on the way. It is great to be able to watch whatever, wherever. All of the equipment is nicely built into a rack in the basement. As the final approval of this process even my wife likes the way it works.

[C4CPA]

Mercedes

What controller do you have running navigator on the video switch? If I have 5 sources (3 cable boxes, BluRay, and disk changer) and 7 TV, will one controller support all of this? ie. can I watch 4 different shows on 4 different TV with no problem? What is the average cost for a system like this, $5,000, or do I need a second mortgage?

[cyblog]

If you're gonna use C4 the recommended way would be to use a controller per TV, so at minimum a 6 HC-200 for each TV along with a master controller such as HC-300 for the 7th TV. This way each TV will have it's own remote control SR-250 or SR-150 and be able to control any video source along with a full on-screen display of the C4 interface. If you don't plan to be using all the TVs at once then you could scale it down to maybe 4 controllers for 4 TVs at a time....etc

[ILoveC4]

I absolutely love my video distribution. I have my cable boxes, DVR, disc changer, EVA9150, and a controller (for navigator) as inputs, and all my TV's as outputs. I love the look of only having the TV on the wall, and I love being able to switch rooms without interrupting the video source. Example: last night my wife and I were watching a movie in the loft. We decided it was time to go to bed so we paused the movie, turned that video skource on in the bedroom, turned off the loft, went downstairs to the bedroom and it was on the TV paused, ready to be resumed.

With the number of controllers/navigators required, just think of how many on screen GUI's you'll use at any given time. It is just my wife and I using the system as our kids are still too young (2 years old and 1 year old), so we just have one navigator ran through the switch. As my kids get older, the basement gets finished, and we add more TV's in the kids rooms and basement we will get more navigators. It really just depends on how many instances of the on screen navigators will run at once.

Wow...long post on my blackberry with several distractions. Hopefully that all makes sense.

[tebery]

When I put my C4 system in, I was against video distribution, mainly because I never had it and was not sure what to expect. My dealer convinced me into it and the family and I love it. We have 4 HD Directv DVR's, (one for each member of the family), 2 Sony 777's and a single disc dvd hooked into it. Distributed onto 5 tvs. We only have one controller for OSD and also never have problems with people accessing it at the same time.

The only drawback is if something happens to your system (has not happened yet) you are kind of screwed.

So if you can afford it, go for it!

[mercedes]

I have 3 dedicated primary TV viewing areas. I have a controller, hc-300, locally at each of those. I put an HC-200 in the master bedroom since I wanted to make sure we always had full access to the navigator there as well. I have an hc-500 that sits in my rack along with my hc-1000. I share the 500 navigator on 9 additional TV's in areas like the game room, exercise, bar, kids rooms, master bath, kitchen, and out side deck. I have never had a problem where someone couldn't get the navigator when they needed it. The kids watch the most tv on that controller and they pretty much just use the sr-250 watch and listen options.

Mercedes

What controller do you have running navigator on the video switch? If I have 5 sources (3 cable boxes, BluRay, and disk changer) and 7 TV, will one controller support all of this? ie. can I watch 4 different shows on 4 different TV with no problem? What is the average cost for a system like this, $5,000, or do I need a second mortgage?

[RyanE]

That's a reasonable solution. The nice thing about having *some* controllers throughout the house is that it helps out your ZigBee mesh. It's also handy to have local IR outputs, etc.

The nice thing about sharing a controller or two in the rack with video distribution is that it's less expensive.

RyanE

[C4CPA]

When I put my C4 system in, I was against video distribution, mainly because I never had it and was not sure what to expect. My dealer convinced me into it and the family and I love it. We have 4 HD Directv DVR's, (one for each member of the family), 2 Sony 777's and a single disc dvd hooked into it. Distributed onto 5 tvs. We only have one controller for OSD and also never have problems with people accessing it at the same time.

The only drawback is if something happens to your system (has not happened yet) you are kind of screwed.

So if you can afford it, go for it!

I am still trying to fully understand all of this C4 technology. So it sounds like I can have one controller, and it can be used to control what is showing on multiple TV's. I can use that controller to show different shows on each TV as long as I dont try to use controller at the exact same time on multiple TV's?

Do you have a seperate remote control SR 250 for each of your additional TV's? Or do you just carry the same remote control into different rooms that have a TV in them?

[ILoveC4]

Controllers can run multiple "functions". One of the functions a controller can run is Navigator. Navigator is the onscreen menu that comes up on your TV. The "Circle of Power" or "COP" as most commonly referred to. If you have a controller that runs navigator for multiple TV's, it can only be displayed on one TV at a time. It can run navigator fan as many TV's as you want, it's only limitation is that only one TV can be looking at the COP at a time.

You will also need a controller to run director. Technically, you can have Control4 with NO navigators, just a director telling everything what to do. A controller can run both navigator AND director at the same time, but it isn't typically recommended because of the computing power consumed by each function.

Does that help a little bit?

[RyanE]

You certainly *could* have only one SR-250, and change rooms on it all the time, but that's not terribly convenient, and it would *definitely* be recommended you have one for each room you want control in.

Also, there is a *slight* penalty to a single controller being shared among rooms, it has to do a room change every time it's called for in a different room. Some people would notice, others might not mind.

RyanE

[tebery]

When I put my C4 system in' date=' I was against video distribution, mainly because I never had it and was not sure what to expect. My dealer convinced me into it and the family and I love it. We have 4 HD Directv DVR's, (one for each member of the family), 2 Sony 777's and a single disc dvd hooked into it. Distributed onto 5 tvs. We only have one controller for OSD and also never have problems with people accessing it at the same time.

The only drawback is if something happens to your system (has not happened yet) you are kind of screwed.

So if you can afford it, go for it![/quote']

I am still trying to fully understand all of this C4 technology. So it sounds like I can have one controller, and it can be used to control what is showing on multiple TV's. I can use that controller to show different shows on each TV as long as I dont try to use controller at the exact same time on multiple TV's?

Do you have a seperate remote control SR 250 for each of your additional TV's? Or do you just carry the same remote control into different rooms that have a TV in them?

I have a version2 remote for each tv location. Each remote is set for the tv location of where it is at, so when you press power on the remote it changes the OSD to the tv locaion of that remote.

[akg4y]

Here's my opinion on centralized versus non-centralized video:

Pros of centralized:

1) Less clutter, equipment can all be hidden in one location (basement/closet/etc).

2) Less equipment needed. In my house in general the DISH will only be watched on two TVs maximum but if we didnt have centralized video I would need at least 5 DISH receivers, plus its easy to just add a TV to a room and have full access to all sources.

3) Flexibility - You can access everything everywhere. If I didnt have centralized video there would be no way I would have a media player in each location, and as such I wouldnt have access to my whole library of digitized movies that magically made their way onto my NAS.

4) Awesomeness - The coolness factor is easy to understand, and people are always impressed.

Cons of centralized:

1) Cost - For the amount I paid I could have easily bought equipment for each room in the house and had money for a few more TVs.

2) Complexity - There is some extra skill needed to have this programmed correctly and not have people interfering with each other's viewing if you have a busy household.

3) Other than the possible JAP distribution just released, HDMI distribution has generally been a no-no.

Pros of non-centralized:

1) Easy to understand - For the less technically inclined, no matter how easy C4 makes video distribution it still makes more sense to them if they can see the equipment available sitting in front of them.

2) Cheaper

3) Much easier to upgrade wiring if needed

Cons of non-centralized:

1) Lots of ugly equipment staring you in the face unless you have plenty of nooks and crannies to hide them in.

2) Your grandpa does non-centralized.

[bebster]

The big pro that I see for centralized is the ability for "follow-me viewing", i.e. watch first part of a show in one room and move to another to catch the rest of it.

[akg4y]

I think with DVRs now you can do that with most service providers (DISH/DirectTV/FIOS/Comcast). I hear FIOS is coming out with a media player receiver now also...

[stenkb]

I have 1 (yes that says one) HC300 - and again I say 'one' it controls 2 mini touch screens, the on screen navigator, 2 cable boxes, a blue ray player, a netgear media player, 3 remotes, 4 lcd tv's, my mp3 music, and movies, oh ya my screensavers and I have about 50 dimmers/switches.

Beat that!!!

Oh ya - and it works too! :o

yes im sure it would run faster if I spent an additional $5000 - but for me it all works fine - and that would be overkill....so to say that you 'need' a controller for every tv plus a main controller - i'd say bahhh.

[thecodeman]

I have 1 (yes that says one) HC300 - and again I say 'one' it controls 2 mini touch screens, the on screen navigator, 2 cable boxes, a blue ray player, a netgear media player, 3 remotes, 4 lcd tv's, my mp3 music, and movies, oh ya my screensavers and I have about 50 dimmers/switches.

Beat that!!!

Oh ya - and it works too! :o

yes im sure it would run faster if I spent an additional $5000 - but for me it all works fine - and that would be overkill....so to say that you 'need' a controller for every tv plus a main controller - i'd say bahhh.

That would never work for me with my wife and kid (when he's older) trying to use the navigator at the same time.

[stenkb]

Ya - i hear ya - but me and my wife pretty much never use the navigator.....maybe that seems odd - but just never do. we use the mini touch screens to start music (mp3's) and the remotes to choose the video source. Maybe once i get my netgear eva 9150 going - I might use the navigator to choose movies...........

[C4CPA]

Thanks to everyone that has posted pros and cons about a video distribution system. But nobody has even commented on my question about cost. What is the average cost for a system like this, $5,000, or do I need a second mortgage? Is it taboo to ask about cost on this forum?

[ILoveC4]

It isn't taboo to ask about cost...it is a difficult question to answer though. How much is a sports car? How does does a Porsche cost? I want a 6 cylinder, probably with a turbo. Is that going to be expensive?

I don't mean to be a smartass, but you can see why that question is tough. It all depends on what you want to distribute (vga, component, hdmi, digital audio, L/R stereo, etc...), how many inputs, and how many outputs? I can tell you that you can definately get a video distribution system for under $5,000, and you can definately spend WAY more than that. It all depends on *what* is included in a "video distribution system"; IE: TV's, blueray players, DVD changer, digital media players, etc...

That my friend, is why nobody has answered your question. If you want a specific answer, you will need to provide:

A) What cabling you already have in place.

What resolution you want to distribute.

C) How many inputs/outputs.

D) The distance from the switch to each TV.

At that point, any number of people on this forum could get you a reasonable quote. My advice? Call a dealer, ask some questions, and get a quote. Any figure you would get on here about cost would be a shot in the dark, to say the least.

[C4CPA]

I have 1 (yes that says one) HC300 - and again I say 'one' it controls 2 mini touch screens, the on screen navigator, 2 cable boxes, a blue ray player, a netgear media player, 3 remotes, 4 lcd tv's, my mp3 music, and movies, oh ya my screensavers and I have about 50 dimmers/switches.

Beat that!!!

Oh ya - and it works too! :o

yes im sure it would run faster if I spent an additional $5000 - but for me it all works fine - and that would be overkill....so to say that you 'need' a controller for every tv plus a main controller - i'd say bahhh.

This sounds like my kind of system. If I have a TV that is not used very much, I do not want to purchase a controller just so I can run navigator once a week. I will certainly put multiple TV's on one controller. Is it correct that I could put multiple TV's on one controller and if I have a mini touch screen in a room I would really never need to use the navigator in that room since I could use the mini touch screen?

What happens if you have one controller running 2 TV and someone in both rooms attempts to use navigator at the same time? Does one of the people just get an error message “not available?” Or does the entire system shut down?

Could I purchase one HC500 and run the video distribution, security system (4 sources and 5 TV’s), 2 Mini touch screens, and about 20 dimmers/switches? I would also put a remote with each TV. Actually the mini touch screens would probably by my iPhone and the iPhone my wife has. Will the iPhone app do everything that the 7” touch screen will do.

[thecodeman]

This sounds like my kind of system. If I have a TV that is not used very much, I do not want to purchase a controller just so I can run navigator once a week. I will certainly put multiple TV's on one controller. Is it correct that I could put multiple TV's on one controller and if I have a mini touch screen in a room I would really never need to use the navigator in that room since I could use the mini touch screen?

Yes, but you will hate the Mini Touch Screen for anything other than music really - an iPhone app, or 7" would be a better investment at this point.

What happens if you have one controller running 2 TV and someone in both rooms attempts to use navigator at the same time?

They will "fight" for control, since one remote will be in one room, the second remote in the other, and the rooms will switch back and forth and it will be frustrating to use.

Does one of the people just get an error message “not available?”

No.

Or does the entire system shut down?

No.

Could I purchase one HC500 and run the video distribution, security system (4 sources and 5 TV’s), 2 Mini touch screens, and about 20 dimmers/switches? I would also put a remote with each TV. Actually the mini touch screens would probably by my iPhone and the iPhone my wife has.

Yes, the HC500 will run that equipment without a problem.

Will the iPhone app do everything that the 7” touch screen will do.

Yes, at the moment. There are hardware features like proximity sensor that the phone doesn't have, and when 2.0 comes out the 7" will get the flash navigator and the iPhone app may not.

[bsanf3]

I have 1 (yes that says one) HC300 - and again I say 'one' it controls 2 mini touch screens, the on screen navigator, 2 cable boxes, a blue ray player, a netgear media player, 3 remotes, 4 lcd tv's, my mp3 music, and movies, oh ya my screensavers and I have about 50 dimmers/switches.

Beat that!!!

Oh ya - and it works too! :o

yes im sure it would run faster if I spent an additional $5000 - but for me it all works fine - and that would be overkill....so to say that you 'need' a controller for every tv plus a main controller - i'd say bahhh.

Having two Sony 400 disc changers, two ReadyNASes with several hundred videos, +1000 ripped CD/MP3s using one controller was just getting to slow navigation wise, upgrading most of the controllers to HC-200 and HC-300s helped with a HC-500 soon. A HC-1000 is on my list.

Byron

[bhadams]

C4CPA, a friend asked the same price question the other day. I'm not good at ball parking, so we went through the exercise of pricing out a particular system as an example for his home.

As our example,

-6 locations of two channel audio , with the main room adding a subwoofer.

-3 of those audio locations were video locations via component video over cat5e/6.

-one HC300, one HC200 + an extra remote to cover all three video locations.

-1 7" touchpanel, 2 4" minitouchs.

-3 local video sources at various locations running back to the home run.

-4 video sources at the home run.

-2 digital audio sources.

-everything at the home run in a finished equipment rack.

-all audio and video sources available everywhere.

-**did not include the cost of WIRING, LABOR, or TVs (which can be justifiably substaintial).**

Again for equipment only (again no WIRING, LABOR, or TV's), it came up to around $14,500 - $15,500 full retail.

Hope that helps a little.