Jobu604 Posted March 24, 2011 Share Posted March 24, 2011 I have a rooftop patio and due to the steel construction my network/Internet signal dies as I get outside. I have been able, however, to get Cat5 up to the patio through a clean air return vent.All's good, but I need to leave an access point outside to give me coverage while I'm up on the patio. Aside from getting a regular router/access point and encasing it in something weatherproof, are there actually any products out there that are intended for permanent outdoor use?I've googled for awhile and it seems like there are some industrial products, but I'm just loooking for a reasonbly priced consumer product. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chicagoskiguy Posted March 24, 2011 Share Posted March 24, 2011 As far as reasonably priced Outdoor Access Points, I've had decent luck with Engenius Products in the past. I'll tell you right now that their documentation is pretty bad, but there are youtube videos made by users to supplement some of the documentation. Most of their products support POE, and come with an injector so your cat5 should be all you need. http://www.newegg.com/Store/BrandSubCategory.aspx?Brand=2037&SubCategory=335&name=ENGENIUS-TECHNOLOGIES-Wireless-AP-Bridges&Order=PRICEI believe they have an 802.11n outdoor product launching soon, but I don't have a date for that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avittech Posted March 24, 2011 Share Posted March 24, 2011 If you want awesome do Ruckus Wireless. If you want inexpensive I recomend the Picostation by Ubiquiti. These are the 2 I normally sell on each end of the price spectum.http://www.ruckuswireless.com/products/zoneflex-outdoorhttp://www.ubnt.com/picostation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jobu604 Posted March 24, 2011 Author Share Posted March 24, 2011 Thanks guys, this is good stuff. What would be my best bet for a device that had a built in switch as well as the access point (or is that where we run into problems)? I may want to hardwire a speakerpoint to this device -- I can't run speakerwire through the same route as the Cat5 comes from, and I've got some outdoor speakers currently running on a wireless speakerpoint which is not ideal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avittech Posted March 24, 2011 Share Posted March 24, 2011 The ruckus has a PoE output as wellhttp://c929.r29.cf2.rackcdn.com/ds-zoneflex-7762.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jobu604 Posted March 24, 2011 Author Share Posted March 24, 2011 The Ruckus would definitely work, but I was thinking more like $200 than $2000. Is there something in that lower price range that you can recommend, which has an Ethernet output as well? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgbrown Posted March 24, 2011 Share Posted March 24, 2011 Have you thought about just extending the antenna off an access point placed inside the dwelling (out of the elements) ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jobu604 Posted March 24, 2011 Author Share Posted March 24, 2011 Have you thought about just extending the antenna off an access point placed inside the dwelling (out of the elements) ?That was an initial thought, but the goal is to hardwire a speakerpoint AND provide outdoor Internet access. I'm not a big fan of the wireless speakerpoints even with a stronger signal, for a few reasons. I'm in a condo, so I can't drill through the roof/membrane, and there's no room to get anything other than Cat5 up to the rooftop. (Otherwise, I'd just place the speakerpoint with the rest of my equipment and run speakerwire.)I was thinking the best and most efficient way to do this would be with a single piece of equipment, e.g., some sort of weatherproof access point/router (the Ruckus model with the Ethernet output, for example), but if we start getting into the thousands of dollars I have more appealing options.So I guess what I am asking is if anyone has any ideas for a solution to provide hardwire to the speakerpoint and wireless, given that I have ethernet/Cat5 and, if necessary, power (I don't have to rely on PoE). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ichbinbose Posted March 24, 2011 Share Posted March 24, 2011 pakedge makes a outdoor access point http://pakedge.com/products_accesspoints.php?prod=7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EagleMoon Posted March 24, 2011 Share Posted March 24, 2011 I have been able, however, to get Cat5 up to the patio through a clean air return vent.Let's back up a couple steps. First, regarding the speakerpoint, you got one Cat5 up there, can you get a second one so that you can use it for the speakerpoint and not need a switch built into the access point?Second, do you have no protected space (under the eave, for example) where you can mount a regular access point and not need the pricier outdoor-rated versions? If you don't, where will/did you mount the speaker point? (I don't know for a fact but I don't think those are exterior devices, are they?)I ran a simple Linksys WRT54G mounted under the eave of my house for 7 years with no problems, powered over a POE injector. I also had one in the attic over the garage for another area. That one did fine even in the Texas heat and though mounted inside the attic, its signal reached about 150 feet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chicagoskiguy Posted March 24, 2011 Share Posted March 24, 2011 Aren't you going to need some sort of weatherproof enclosure for the speakerpoint anyway? Why not just get a standard router, put it into WAP mode, and stick it next to the speakerpoint? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jobu604 Posted March 24, 2011 Author Share Posted March 24, 2011 I have been able' date=' however, to get Cat5 up to the patio through a clean air return vent.[/quote']Let's back up a couple steps. First, regarding the speakerpoint, you got one Cat5 up there, can you get a second one so that you can use it for the speakerpoint and not need a switch built into the access point?I could probably use the existing cable as a fish to get two up there... not a bad idea. It's what I was thinking if I can't find a reasonably priced access point with a built-in switch.Second, do you have no protected space (under the eave, for example) where you can mount a regular access point and not need the pricier outdoor-rated versions? If you don't, where will/did you mount the speaker point? (I don't know for a fact but I don't think those are exterior devices, are they?)No protected area, unfortunately -- it's a rooftop patio with no eaves. The speakerpoint is encased in a weatherproof casing, and the casing is placed on a stainless steel cart which adds additional protection from above. I doubt it would hold up in harsh environments, but I'm in Vancouver, BC and we don't get too cold or too hot. It's lasted for over a year now.I ran a simple Linksys WRT54G mounted under the eave of my house for 7 years with no problems, powered over a POE injector. I also had one in the attic over the garage for another area. That one did fine even in the Texas heat and though mounted inside the attic, its signal reached about 150 feet.I could probably encase an indoor rated router in a similar weatherproof enclosure like I have my speakerpoint. That's what I was thinking at first, before realizing there might be an outdoor rated product. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jobu604 Posted March 24, 2011 Author Share Posted March 24, 2011 Aren't you going to need some sort of weatherproof enclosure for the speakerpoint anyway? Why not just get a standard router, put it into WAP mode, and stick it next to the speakerpoint?Probably what I will do now that I think about it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EagleMoon Posted March 24, 2011 Share Posted March 24, 2011 Aren't you going to need some sort of weatherproof enclosure for the speakerpoint anyway? Why not just get a standard router' date=' put it into WAP mode, and stick it next to the speakerpoint?[/quote']Probably what I will do now that I think about it You probably should get something like the Engenius devices for 100-150USD and be done with it. Especially if you can get the second wire up there for the speakerpoint. Power it via POE; get external injectors if necessary.But I would expect the wireless speaker point to work fine when it's right beside the AP. (Never used one myself, so I know nothing...)Edit: Use POE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avittech Posted March 24, 2011 Share Posted March 24, 2011 The picostation would work great. It's only $100 and comes with the poe adapter. - Let me know if you need one. It is also 1000mw, not 100mw like most AP. I am an Engenius dealer as well. I really like the picostation for simple outdoor access. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jobu604 Posted March 24, 2011 Author Share Posted March 24, 2011 The picostation would work great. It's only $100 and comes with the poe adapter. - Let me know if you need one. It is also 1000mw, not 100mw like most AP. I am an Engenius dealer as well. I really like the picostation for simple outdoor access.If I placed the Picostation in close proximity to the speakerpoint, do you anticipate any issues with dropouts? I'm not that concerned about lag.My speakerpoint is currently set up wirelessly, and the signal is very weak... some of my sources don't work at all, and those that do (Rhapsody) suffer a lot of dropout. If having a strong wirleless signal virtually right next to the speakerpoint is as effective as hardwiring the speakerpoint, then the Picostation would definitely do... in that case, happy to order it from you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EagleMoon Posted March 24, 2011 Share Posted March 24, 2011 My speakerpoint is currently set up wirelessly, and the signal is very weak... some of my sources don't work at all, and those that do (Rhapsody) suffer a lot of dropout. If having a strong wirleless signal virtually right next to the speakerpoint is as effective as hardwiring the speakerpoint, then the Picostation would definitely do... in that case, happy to order it from you.Do it. There's no reason why the wireless connection to the speaker point would affect some sources more than others. It's transport -- it either works well or it works poorly, but all of its sources are on the wired side, right? The specifics of where in the wired side they originate has no bearing on whether the wireless transport works well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jobu604 Posted March 24, 2011 Author Share Posted March 24, 2011 My speakerpoint is currently set up wirelessly' date=' and the signal is very weak... some of my sources don't work at all, and those that do (Rhapsody) suffer a lot of dropout. If having a strong wirleless signal virtually right next to the speakerpoint is as effective as hardwiring the speakerpoint, then the Picostation would definitely do... in that case, happy to order it from you.[/quote']Do it. There's no reason why the wireless connection to the speaker point would affect some sources more than others. It's transport -- it either works well or it works poorly, but all of its sources are on the wired side, right? The specifics of where in the wired side they originate has no bearing on whether the wireless transport works well.I currently have a very weak signal, but for some reason Rhapsody works better than radio, TV or iPod dock. It could just be on different days/environmental conditions affecting it. I almost exclusively use Rhapsody, and it's generally fine but goes in and out. I'm actually surprised it is as good as it is considering I get such a weak signal.My worry is that even with a strong signal the wireless speakerpoint won't be as reliable as wired. If I am going to go through this trouble, I want to make sure everything works the way it should. I don't want to add a wireless AP and not wire the speakerpoint if it will cause me trouble. That said, as long as I have the Cat5 up there, even if the wireless AP doesn't work as well I could add a cheapie indoor router and put it in a weatherproof enclosure I suppose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RyanE Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 I have been able, however, to get Cat5 up to the patio through a clean air return vent.BTW, I don't know if anyone has commented on this in the thread, but this is *not* legal according to the NEC, and I wouldn't do it myself.You cannot run *ANY* wire through return air vents, no matter the type of wire and insulation rating.RyanE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EagleMoon Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 That said, as long as I have the Cat5 up there, even if the wireless AP doesn't work as well I could add a cheapie indoor router and put it in a weatherproof enclosure I suppose.I think you'll be okay with wireless but you could just try cheap wireless router first. It would give you wired ports for the speaker point. If it works, you spent maybe a little less money, though the enclosure adds some cost. But try it before buying the enclosure.You probably know this, but if you use a router, be sure to disable its DHCP service and use only its LAN ports (unless you can configure it to *bridge* to the WAN port -- most cheap ones can't be). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jobu604 Posted March 25, 2011 Author Share Posted March 25, 2011 I have been able' date=' however, to get Cat5 up to the patio through a clean air return vent.[/quote']BTW, I don't know if anyone has commented on this in the thread, but this is *not* legal according to the NEC, and I wouldn't do it myself.You cannot run *ANY* wire through return air vents, no matter the type of wire and insulation rating.RyanEit's fine. vent is unused and not connected to any ducting or hvac. it's a hole, effectively, no different than drilling through framing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RyanE Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 Okey Dokey. What you have there is likely a *combustion air vent*, not a *return* air vent.Big difference. Makes sense. Carry on.RyanE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xc420 Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 If you are going to run it, make sure the cat5 is plenum rated. The insulation jacket of cat5 cable is toxic when burned, so non-plenum rated cable should never be ran in an airspace. You might not have it connected to hvac or ducting now, but if you ever sell the house the next owner might decide to connect it up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ILoveC4 Posted March 25, 2011 Share Posted March 25, 2011 It sounds like it is just a duct to ensure the "furnace room" has plenty of fresh air and doesn't create a vacuum, sucking gas into your system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jobu604 Posted March 25, 2011 Author Share Posted March 25, 2011 It sounds like it is just a duct to ensure the "furnace room" has plenty of fresh air and doesn't create a vacuum, sucking gas into your system.This is correct. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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