Crestron Adagio and Control4 Comparison

[Matt]

I’d almost add a 200 (navigator) to the project and run the 300 director disable navigator. Use the media controller strictly for media management.

[RyanE]

It really depends on the size of your project and how often you use Navigator, but moving them around might make a small improvement, but it shouldn't have anything to do with the *stability* of the system (requiring reboots).

I agree with Matt, for the price of an HC-200 and installation, you could have the HC-300 running the project and *no* navigator, which would certainly improve things somewhat.

RyanE

[Big_Tex]

What does Navigator do? What's its purpose?

Thx

[thecodeman]

What does Navigator do? What's its purpose?

Thx

On screen display, allows you to "navigate" the project using the tv.

[Big_Tex]

Thanks Codeman... So if I never use Navigator on my TV I shouldn't be taxing the CPU. What about the navigator (interface) that runs on the touch screens...is this the same Navigator or something else? I.E. if I want to improve the performance of my touch screens (response time) would it make sense to put the Navigator on my HC-1000 versus my MTC?

Thanks!!!!!

[henniae]

Thanks Codeman... So if I never use Navigator on my TV I shouldn't be taxing the CPU. What about the navigator (interface) that runs on the touch screens...is this the same Navigator or something else? I.E. if I want to improve the performance of my touch screens (response time) would it make sense to put the Navigator on my HC-1000 versus my MTC?

Thanks!!!!!

Navigator runs on the touch screen seperate from any version of navigator running on a HC-300/HC-500. You cannot shut off Navigator on a touchscreen because it would not be able to display the COP. Basically, Navigator runs on any device that provides the COP (Circle of Power). If you have multiple touchscreens each is running its own copy of Navigator. If you have multiple HC-300/HC-500 each runs a separate copy of Navigator. If a HC-300/HC-500 does not have its video output connected to a display you can disable the Navigator process that device.

Navigator does not run on the HC-1000 sine it does not have any way to display to a TV.There is only one reason to have an HC-1000 and that is to run a single copy of Director for your project. Each project can have only one copy of director running.

[Big_Tex]

Ah ha!!!! Now I understand.

Thanks!

[akg4y]

I think you guys succeeded in making GoGo disappear, which I think is unfortunate as he did provide informative and beneficial posts at times. Dissenting opinions often get lambasted, particularly on the internet, but that doesnt mean they dont deserve to be heard.

[Kevin L]

I think you guys succeeded in making GoGo disappear, which I think is unfortunate as he did provide informative and beneficial posts at times. Dissenting opinions often get lambasted, particularly on the internet, but that doesnt mean they dont deserve to be heard.

actually none of his comparisons were that valid.. if you looked at every feature he was trying to recommend vs the control4 product.. control4 was a better deal and had more features

its pathetic to come onto a CONTROL4 forum and literally do nothing but bash control4 and recommend something else.. he does not deserve to post here

[Mav-Jason]

^^^agreed

[joed]

What I have noticed over the last couple of months is a very negative attitude by some posters. If you don't like what someone says then prove them wrong. Name calling and telling someone to "get the hell off of this board" is immature.

Having watched GoGo over the years I have a hard time believing that he is gone for ever. See you soon James.

[Paul_Quadriom]

Oooooh brother.... now he has a fan club.... is that you GoGo, jdordan????

Just in case some of you didn't notice, this is a Control4 user and users to be forum. We (dealers) come here to help people who want information and/or who have problems with their systems and we try to help them out as much as we can.

This is not a general custom install forum where brand bashing is a common thing, they're other forums for this. The user in question is neither a user or a C4 dealer, he's just someone who has had a bad personal experience with C4 and since then decided to hang around here to boost his Crestron sales which he says he's a dealer.

If you have been watching him over the years as you say you have, you probably noticed that most if not all of his posts have a goal; to promote Creston or other things he sell by bashing C4 by comparing the 2 . All you have to do is go thru the other threads and in the For Sale section, you will see.

Also, you may have not noticed but since he started "selling" on this forum, a lot of Control4 DEALERS (including me) have stopped hanging around because they have found that they were wasting their time and found this guys as annoying as he really is. I know I talked to some of them.

He is a trouble maker and loves the attention and if he only stopped posting his negative C4 comments and comparisons (since he is welcome here as everyone else is), the name calling would, GoGo away.

[Kevin L]

What I have noticed over the last couple of months is a very negative attitude by some posters. If you don't like what someone says then prove them wrong. Name calling and telling someone to "get the hell off of this board" is immature.

Having watched GoGo over the years I have a hard time believing that he is gone for ever. See you soon James.

i have not had a negative attitude.. I have constantly disproved everything he says on this board and on AVS forum.. go join the fan club somewhere else.. This is a Control4 board NOT a board to talk about how crestron is better than control4. That is ALL James ever talks about. that IS IMMATURE AND HE DOES NOT BELONG ON THIS MESSAGE BOARD.

[joed]

First off I am a Control4 user. My system was install in Jan 2006. I have been registered on this forum and reading it since it started. I remember the initial threads at AVSforums before Brent and CytexOne started their forums. I love my system and I promote Control4 to my friend and family.

While I don't agree with everything that James posts, I do like the difference of opinions. Since this thread was referencing Crestron vs Control4 I didn't find his comments inappropriate. If you think Control4 is better than Crestron than you should be able to quiet him down quick. Use logic and a casual reader will be able to figure it out as well.

I think the pictures of the Crestron install that Audio Atmosphere posted said more than anything else I read in this thread.

As I have said before, this forum needs the ability to allow a reader to filter out messages from users they don't like. That way people who don't like certain users can be happy.

- Joe

[RyanE]

Were you saying something, Joe?

I think my filter must've removed your message from the thread.

RyanE

[joed]

Were you saying something, Joe?

I think my filter must've removed your message from the thread.

RyanE

I thought you were starting to warm up to me

[GoGo Delicious]

WOW . . .I have been gone for about 4 or 5 days and this topic is still being talked about. Well let me bring everyone up to speed as to what has been going on.

First - I did not "disappear". I had a job to finish by Thursday and that evening I had to go fly out to FL for the Super Bowl, work not play (ok a little play. side note I am not a football fan at all. For some reason I just can not get into it.).

Second - Email. I have received quite a few emails from members of this board all were positive AND insightful I might add. I want to let those know that while I read every email I wont be able to respond to them all. I do have to say this about the emails though. Although they were supportive they all had one underlying theme which was this. In almost every email I received the senders were disappointed in a few, I won't say the names they mentioned but it's obvious when you read the thread, who they felt took a very positive and informative thread and destroyed it. Here is a actual quote from a email. "It's a shame that you have a few posters on this board who seem intent on wearing their ignorance on their shirt sleeves. A majority, not all, of these poster are Control4 dealers. Why is it that they are so negative? A legitimate question was asked and you answered it in fact the original poster stated ""James, I was hoping you would reply because you are a Crestron dealer who is familiar with Control 4."" Do these negative posters really think Control4 end users respect them?" He goes on with more but you get the gist of it. That was the underlying feeling of pretty much all the emails I received.

Third - The original poster. He emailed me off board and we decided to take the conversation there. He has emailed me complete details of his lay out, everything short of the blueprints and I told him this AM that I wold get back to him with various options. It's a shame that a potential Control4 customer who asked a legitimate question regarding price and feature comparison between Control4 and Crestron has his thread hi jacked and has to go out and get the information via email. Going back to #2 above I received a few email that were "put off" by some the Control4 dealers negative responses.

Fourth - Quoting Price. I listed two quotes, along with the equipment, in response to the original posters questions. I received a few emails asking if the pricing I gave was, real, did I discount it, did that include all hardware, and one asking if it included power. In response to the first 3 questions, yes that's the real price, no, I did not discount it that was actual MSRP (we as a dealer do not discount off MSRP we did in the past depending on the job, client, etc).

As far as power issue goes I asked him what he meant by "does this include power". He stated that someone on the board said I did not include power for the TP's. I went back to read the responses and it was posted that I did not calculate for power consumption by the TP's. The poster ASSUMED that I did not list a power supply in the price. Crestron's in wall TP's and other equipment are powered by Cresnet. Cresnet delivers power, along with data, from the Cres"Net" connection on the back of most controllers to the TP's and other Cresnet devices. A designer has to take into account how much power, aka wattage, a processor has that Cresnet can use to power TP's and other Cresnet devices. They teach us this from the get go. It's Crestron design 101. Well, since Control4 does not use LV to power their in wall TP's like Crestron does most C4 users would not know why they need an additional power supply. In order not to confuse any one on this board as to why there is a power supply I left it off the items listed BUT I INCLUDED it in the price. I also left a few other items of the off list BUT again I INCLUDED them in the pricing. IF the person actually requests a price quote they would get a room by room, line by line price quote with every little detail itemized and in the end the price would still be what I originally quoted.

As far as those emailing asking for a Crestron quote. We only do resi. (residential) through Builders, Architects and Interior Designers. With some exceptions, we do not take on resi. jobs that come straight to us. IF you are truly interested and are serious about Crestron email me again and I will contact you. Do not email me just to compare prices. With the exception of the original poster, we do charge a fee for a design quote.

Fifth - My Feelings On Control4. I did get a few questions asking why I, and I quote, "hate control4"? The truth is that I do NOT hate "Control4" as a company or product (my best fried and his wife are a Control4 dealer and I do help him out every once in a while). My dislikes lies else where and I will not going into or elaborate further on what they are.

In talking to the original poster I have stated the following in regards to going with either Control4 or Crestron "I want you to make a educated decision even if that decision means you go with Control4. As long as you have all the facts on both products only you can make a decision on what's right for you." I have not once said in this thread or in email exchanges with the original poster, anything negative about Control4 nor have I tried to persuade the original poster to go with Crestron.

Sixth - Response To Various Posts Within This Thread. I will restate what some had said to me in a email "It's a shame that you have a few posters on this board who seem intent on wearing their ignorance on their shirt sleeves." It's obvious who these posters are you can read their posts and see right through them and I will not patronize their response as it only feeds their ignorance.

A few of the emails I received did mention that there were questions the senders wanted to ask but were afraid of being criticized about asking a Crestron question on a Control4 forum. If you are serious and you do have legitimate question regarding THE TOPIC of this thread I will be more than happy to answer you. DO NOT BE AFRAID. This is ONLY a forum. Only a automation product. No harm will come to you. I promise.

Here are a few examples of legitimate questions that people have posted on this topic.

1 - http://www.c4forums.com/viewtopic.php?pid=18378#p18378

2 - http://www.c4forums.com/viewtopic.php?pid=18379#p18379

3 - http://www.c4forums.com/viewtopic.php?pid=18381#p18381

4 - http://www.c4forums.com/viewtopic.php?pid=18399#p18399

At the end of the day who cares what I think or what you think about a particular product, Crestron or Control4. You, the consumer, are the one having to pay for it, you have to be satisfied, your expectations of a system has to be met, you are the one that is going to have to live with it. As I told the original poster I say to anyone contemplating a control system "As long as you have all the facts on both products only you can make a decision on what's right for you." Don't listen to any Control4 dealers or users on this board and don't listen to me. I would suggest that you actually GO to a Control4 dealers show room and a Crestron Dealers show room and ask them questions see how the systems actually work. Touch, play with and get a feel for a Control4 or Crestron Adagio system. That will be the best way to determine what system is good for you.

[Kevin L]

interesting reply James...

did you forget you said this?

[GoGo Delicious]

interesting reply James...

did you forget you said this?

http://audioatmosphere.net/images/james.png

Oh no I did not forget that. I DID say that. But after I said that and after I received the emails that I did receive asking why I dislike Control4 I started to think about why I do. I started dissecting all my past experiences with Control4, the product, company, and dealers. In fact I was thinking about it again this morning. I came to the conclusion that Control4 or the product is NOT a bad product. I would say I misspoke out of haste. At any rate I really did ponder as to why I disliked Control4. After all who really cares what I like or what I think. I came to the conclusion that I was wrong about the reasons I stated in disliking Control4 and as I stated in my post above it has nothing to do with the Company or the product and I will leave it at that. Stating as to why I dislike Control4 will not advance this thread any further and will create more rhetoric so what's the point? Also, this is to everyone out there, PLEASE don't start a thread asking "Why James does not like Control4" it's not appropriate, it will fuel hatred and I will NOT answer as to why.

As I have stated "At the end of the day who cares what I think or what you think about a particular product, Crestron or Control4. You, the consumer, are the one having to pay for it, you have to be satisfied, your expectations of a system has to be met, you are the one that is going to have to live with it." In the end, as long as you have all the facts on both products, only you can make a educated decision on what's right for you.

Again, I came to the conclusion my dislike for Control4 has nothing to do with the company or the product. My dislikes for Control4 lies else where and I will not go into or elaborate further on what they are.

[George P]

...and the hole gets deeper...

Uh Oh....Somebody is lying here...again...

You can't say this:

The updated total for the following would be WELL under $11,000. If you also eliminated the TPMC-4XG it would be under $10,000. If some ones is serious we will give them a quote with the actual price.

This system takes a way the APADS and add's 3 TPS series touch panels and leaves in the TMPC-4XG to make it more in line with the C4 quote. With the addition of the 3 touch panels programming will be needed so I added it in.

Crestron Adagio ADS

1 TPS-4L

2 TPS-6L Full motion video and 2 way intercom.

1 CEN-iDOC

1 TPMC-4XG

Programming 8 hours at the most to be safe. It depends on how detailed the client wants the system. Again this is for AUDIO only.

And also say this:

And, the pricing I gave reflects MSRP pricing. I have not discounted anything.

And then to explain your way out by saying this:

As far as power issue goes I asked him what he meant by "does this include power". He stated that someone on the board said I did not include power for the TP's. I went back to read the responses and it was posted that I did not calculate for power consumption by the TP's. The poster ASSUMED that I did not list a power supply in the price. Crestron's in wall TP's and other equipment are powered by Cresnet. Cresnet delivers power, along with data, from the Cres"Net" connection on the back of most controllers to the TP's and other Cresnet devices. A designer has to take into account how much power, aka wattage, a processor has that Cresnet can use to power TP's and other Cresnet devices. They teach us this from the get go. It's Crestron design 101. Well, since Control4 does not use LV to power their in wall TP's like Crestron does most C4 users would not know why they need an additional power supply. In order not to confuse any one on this board as to why there is a power supply I left it off the items listed BUT I INCLUDED it in the price. I also left a few other items of the off list BUT again I INCLUDED them in the pricing. IF the person actually requests a price quote they would get a room by room, line by line price quote with every little detail itemized and in the end the price would still be what I originally quoted.

A little fact checking says that the MSRP of the above system configuration is exactly: $11,240.00 Any real Crestron dealer can verify that.

And that DOES NOT include any power supplies.

And that DOES NOT include any touch panel engraving. (maybe GoGo uses stickers like the pictures posted in this thread)

And that DOES NOT include any cost for the 8 hours of programming. (unless you provide that free)

And it still DOES NOT include any control ports (IR, RS-232) for the other rooms where there would be equipment.

So there you have it. GoGo is lying in his initial thread and then lies again while making up stories to justify his posts.

I only post this here so that people do not take bad advice into their decision making process. I wouldn't buy a Control4, Crestron or Bose system from GoGo based on what I see here.

Make sure you find a dealer that can prove they know how to design a system properly. This applies to any system. Get a demo, get references and check them.

Later,

George P.

[thecodeman]

Buckle up folks, this thread is going downhill

[Mav-Jason]

roflsauce