Can Zigbee interfere with an RM Remote?

[Don Cohen]

I recently installed a Motorized Curtain Track, to mask the sides of my scope screen when watching content narrower than 2.35:1 aspect ratio.  This YouTube Video shows it in action.

There is a hard stop inserted into the track, to limit the excursion to the narrowest (16:9) Aspect Ratio.  But sometimes I'll watch 1.85:1, or 2.00:1, or 2.20:1, and need the Curtain stopped in an 'in-between' position between fully open and fully closed.

It comes with an RF Remote, which has 3 buttons on it: Open, Close, Stop.  This works fine for the most part, except sometimes when I hit Stop for those 'in-between' positions, when it will reverse direction rather than stop, or keeps going rather than stopping.  This only occurs perhaps 10% to 20% of the time.  I've worked with the manufacturer and we've been unable to identify the cause of this somewhat inconsistent behavior.

Is it possible for the RF Remote for this device, which reportedly operates at 433.92MHz, to be experiencing interference with the Zigbee network?  That's on 2.4GHz, as far as I know, so my uninformed thought would be that there wouldn't be interference.  But being a bit out of my depth here, I wanted to be sure about this.

He asked if I had any other RF Remotes that would be in operation, which might be interfering.  I do have a MadVR Envy Video Processor, which uses an RF Remote, but this wasn't even turned on when I was doing this testing.  And I think my Roku Premiere+ also uses an RF Remote, but again this was not in use at all while I was testing.

My eventual plan is to get the Bond Bridge, and the Chowmain Driver, so I can control the curtain's movement within Control4.  But I would like to better understand what the problem is now before doing that.  It is possible that the curtain's Remote itself is the source of the problem, and the commands generated from within Control4 and Bond will be more precise, but I can't assume that.

Any ideas on the potential for Zigbee interference, or any other cause for the occasional glitch in response, would be appreciated.

[mstafford388]

I don't see how zigbee could be causing interference unless you had a zigbee antenna right next to the motor or something like that.  there could definitely be interference of another kind, or is it possibly just a cheaply built remote?  Do you ever get intermittent issues if you're using the remote very close to the motor?  One thing I will definitely say is make sure that thing is working properly before you integrate.  Integration rarely fixes issues like that.  

[Don Cohen]

1 hour ago, mstafford388 said:

I don't see how zigbee could be causing interference unless you had a zigbee antenna right next to the motor or something like that.  there could definitely be interference of another kind, or is it possibly just a cheaply built remote?  Do you ever get intermittent issues if you're using the remote very close to the motor?  One thing I will definitely say is make sure that thing is working properly before you integrate.  Integration rarely fixes issues like that.  

Thanks for the reply.  The EA1 that serves the Zigbee mesh is in another room, so definitely not close.  There is an EA3 in the Theater Room, but as I indicated, the server is not on this device.

I've only had this set up for about a week, and haven't noticed any issues as far as proximity to the motor (which is usually around 15 feet away).

The basic functions for open and close, for 2.35:1 and 16:9, work perfectly.  It's just the intermittent ones that are sometimes flaky since I have to Stop along the way.

I understand what you're saying about getting things working right before integrating, and have been thinking the same thing.  On the other hand, I won't be any worse off controlling it through Control4, since open and close will be just as reliable as they are now.  And if the problem I'm seeing is because of the remote, where the buttons are bit close to each other, perhaps creating some cross-contact, then the Bond Bridge will solve this.

Any other input or thoughts appreciated.

[Amr]

4 hours ago, Don Cohen said:

I recently installed a Motorized Curtain Track, to mask the sides of my scope screen when watching content narrower than 2.35:1 aspect ratio.  This YouTube Video shows it in action.

There is a hard stop inserted into the track, to limit the excursion to the narrowest (16:9) Aspect Ratio.  But sometimes I'll watch 1.85:1, or 2.00:1, or 2.20:1, and need the Curtain stopped in an 'in-between' position between fully open and fully closed.

It comes with an RF Remote, which has 3 buttons on it: Open, Close, Stop.  This works fine for the most part, except sometimes when I hit Stop for those 'in-between' positions, when it will reverse direction rather than stop, or keeps going rather than stopping.  This only occurs perhaps 10% to 20% of the time.  I've worked with the manufacturer and we've been unable to identify the cause of this somewhat inconsistent behavior.

Is it possible for the RF Remote for this device, which reportedly operates at 433.92MHz, to be experiencing interference with the Zigbee network?  That's on 2.4GHz, as far as I know, so my uninformed thought would be that there wouldn't be interference.  But being a bit out of my depth here, I wanted to be sure about this.

He asked if I had any other RF Remotes that would be in operation, which might be interfering.  I do have a MadVR Envy Video Processor, which uses an RF Remote, but this wasn't even turned on when I was doing this testing.  And I think my Roku Premiere+ also uses an RF Remote, but again this was not in use at all while I was testing.

My eventual plan is to get the Bond Bridge, and the Chowmain Driver, so I can control the curtain's movement within Control4.  But I would like to better understand what the problem is now before doing that.  It is possible that the curtain's Remote itself is the source of the problem, and the commands generated from within Control4 and Bond will be more precise, but I can't assume that.

Any ideas on the potential for Zigbee interference, or any other cause for the occasional glitch in response, would be appreciated.

The simple answer is no, Zigbee will not interfere with RF, RF remotes are very unreliable and it some times misses for no reason, I say go for the Bond, this is what am using for automating RF based devices and much better than anything else.

[Don Cohen]

7 minutes ago, Amr said:

The simple answer is no, Zigbee will not interfere with RF, RF remotes are very unreliable and it some times misses for no reason, I say go for the Bond, this is what am using for automating RF based devices and much better than anything else.

I appreciate the reply.  Hopefully you're right.  I'll likely go for the Bond Bridge and see what happens.

Thanks.

[Cyknight]

20 hours ago, Amr said:

The simple answer is no, Zigbee will not interfere with RF,

The not quite so simple answer is that it shouldn't be interfering based on the frequency you're saying it is on.

Just wanted to point out that as if RF is operating at 2.4 (which is the RF used for wifi 2.4 and zigbee) it can technically interfere (though not likely in a way like you're seeing).

 

That said I agree that a lot of RF remotes, especially when it comes with a 'no-name brand', are garbage and are the most likely failure point.

Just be aware though that it's also possible that the device's RF radio is poor quality, in which case using a better remote (or a bond bridge) may not work as well as it should either. In other words, just getting the Bond Bridge isn't going to cure a bad device - IF that is what you're dealing with.

[Don Cohen]

32 minutes ago, Cyknight said:

The not quite so simple answer is that it shouldn't be interfering based on the frequency you're saying it is on.

Just wanted to point out that as if RF is operating at 2.4 (which is the RF used for wifi 2.4 and zigbee) it can technically interfere (though not likely in a way like you're seeing).

 

That said I agree that a lot of RF remotes, especially when it comes with a 'no-name brand', are garbage and are the most likely failure point.

Just be aware though that it's also possible that the device's RF radio is poor quality, in which case using a better remote (or a bond bridge) may not work as well as it should either. In other words, just getting the Bond Bridge isn't going to cure a bad device - IF that is what you're dealing with.

Thanks for the reply and info.  I'll go ahead with the Bond Bridge, and hope for the best.  Much appreciated.

[Amr]

18 hours ago, Cyknight said:

The not quite so simple answer is that it shouldn't be interfering based on the frequency you're saying it is on.

Just wanted to point out that as if RF is operating at 2.4 (which is the RF used for wifi 2.4 and zigbee) it can technically interfere (though not likely in a way like you're seeing).

 

That said I agree that a lot of RF remotes, especially when it comes with a 'no-name brand', are garbage and are the most likely failure point.

Just be aware though that it's also possible that the device's RF radio is poor quality, in which case using a better remote (or a bond bridge) may not work as well as it should either. In other words, just getting the Bond Bridge isn't going to cure a bad device - IF that is what you're dealing with.

433MHz RF will not interfere with WiFi 2.4GHz from Radio perspective, totally different bands not even the harmonics, as for the remotes, a lot reports switching to bond fixed their issues including myself as we don’t know what we are dealing with, a trial an error is the only way unless we get specific equipment list, I say it will definitely work better than the crappy remote!

[Cyknight]

1 hour ago, Amr said:

433MHz RF will not interfere with WiFi 2.4GHz from Radio perspective, totally different bands not even the harmonics, as for the remotes, a lot reports switching to bond fixed their issues including myself as we don’t know what we are dealing with, a trial an error is the only way unless we get specific equipment list, I say it will definitely work better than the crappy remote!

Yep, but RF in general is any and all frequencies. Technically Wifi and ZigBee are in fact RF, that's all I'm pointing out. Did state in his case assuming the RF mentioned is accurate it wouldn't be an issue. Merely pointing out that a blank statement of "RF doesn't interfere with ZigBee" isn't accurate.

And I also agreed that using a Bond is likely to help, but I've had instances where the issue was the receiving device had a bad radio, not the remote - in which case the Bond doesn't 'magically' fix things.

[RAV]

Go dark.

Turn off or unplug all your other radio stuff nearby. If it fails then, it's vendors fault or environment, or your cursed.

[ekohn00]

433 might be used by garage door opener, baby monitor, alarms....   just think it could be anything that's not not WIFI, bluetooth, or Zigbee.

I like the above idea...go dark....

 

[Don Cohen]

Appreciate the last 2 replies.

Garage Doors are controlled by Z2IO and direct relays.  No baby monitors, alarms.

The Bond Bridge will be delivered Sunday, so I guess I'll know shortly how this will work out.  I can still 'go dark' to further trouble-shoot, but if the Bridge resolves the problem, it won't be necessary.

Thanks - will update the thread when I know more.

[Don Cohen]

Here's an update:

I bought and installed the Bond Bridge, and it was quite easy to pair it with my Motorized Curtains.  Controlling it from the Bridge seems so far to be 100% reliable.

I then added it to my Control4 Project, and once again, control so far is perfectly reliable.

So it seems, if this behavior keeps up, that the Remote was the source of the problem, as several of you suggested, and as I had hoped.

Programming wise, I was able to start the curtain opening, add a delay of any number of seconds, and then a stop command, to control where I want the curtain to stop.  I'll need to play some actual content, to fine-tune the actual stop positions I'll need for 1.85, 2.00, 2.20 etc.  How precise and consistent that stop position will be, and whether it will be accurate enough, remains to be seen, but I'm hopeful.

Appreciate the help I received here.

[Cyknight]

Glad that it seems to have cured the issue!