Converting from Smart Things to C4...(touchscreen, locks, etc.)

[mod220]

I started my smart home journey with Lutron switches (around 75), 8 Reolink Cat 5 cameras on a PC w/ Blue Iris, Yale locks, and a Smart Things hub.   I then added 3 Fire tablets to run Action Tiles.  Everything is great for the money, but after installing my theatre room I bought an EA-1 and a pair of C4 remotes for audio/video in theatre and family rooms.  At this point, I may as well convert from Smart Things to C4 for everything, since the bulk of the investment has been made.     A couple of questions:

1) Touchscreens - I tried adding OS3 but my Fire tablets are too old, before buying new Fire HD, which can't be beat for the money, what are the pros/cons, and advantages of Samsung vs iPad vs Fire, etc.?  I read I cannot go directly to the cameras in the C4 app, the whole point of this is seamlessness and ease of use, other than C4 touchscreens, any way to get full use out of the touchscreen/app?

2) Door Locks - I have four Yale Assure locks, with the Z Wave plus module, will that also work w/ C4 or do I need to swap modules?

3) Doorbell - I originally installed a Doorbird D101S planning to go C4, when I decided to do Smart Things, I did a Ring Pro instead.  any advantage/disadvantage using Doorbird vs Ring at this point?  I have a Cat 5 cable in place, and still have my old Doorbird.  One obvious benefit I believe is unlike the Ring, which doesn't mesh with the other cameras on BI, the Doorbird I assume can integrate to C4 and BI just like another camera?

Anything else I might be missing?  I'm pretty basic, don't need crazy automation, just basic control of locks, lights, AV, and cameras, ideally aggregated so we can push a button or two, and not have to toggle apps...

Thanks!

[eggzlot]

41 minutes ago, mod220 said:

I started my smart home journey with Lutron switches (around 75), 8 Reolink Cat 5 cameras on a PC w/ Blue Iris, Yale locks, and a Smart Things hub.   I then added 3 Fire tablets to run Action Tiles.  Everything is great for the money, but after installing my theatre room I bought an EA-1 and a pair of C4 remotes for audio/video in theatre and family rooms.  At this point, I may as well convert from Smart Things to C4 for everything, since the bulk of the investment has been made.     A couple of questions:

1) Touchscreens - I tried adding OS3 but my Fire tablets are too old, before buying new Fire HD, which can't be beat for the money, what are the pros/cons, and advantages of Samsung vs iPad vs Fire, etc.?  I read I cannot go directly to the cameras in the C4 app, the whole point of this is seamlessness and ease of use, other than C4 touchscreens, any way to get full use out of the touchscreen/app?

2) Door Locks - I have four Yale Assure locks, with the Z Wave plus module, will that also work w/ C4 or do I need to swap modules?

3) Doorbell - I originally installed a Doorbird D101S planning to go C4, when I decided to do Smart Things, I did a Ring Pro instead.  any advantage/disadvantage using Doorbird vs Ring at this point?  I have a Cat 5 cable in place, and still have my old Doorbird.  One obvious benefit I believe is unlike the Ring, which doesn't mesh with the other cameras on BI, the Doorbird I assume can integrate to C4 and BI just like another camera?

Anything else I might be missing?  I'm pretty basic, don't need crazy automation, just basic control of locks, lights, AV, and cameras, ideally aggregated so we can push a button or two, and not have to toggle apps...

Thanks!

1) Touch screens - any modern touchscreen is fine, but only the c4 touchscreens give you access to the intercom function.  Android, Fire, Apple, etc will let you load the c4 app but no intercom function.  Its a slight delay to wake up the tablet, launch/wait for the app to load, etc.  As far as not seeing cameras, that is false.  I have an iPad and I have an Android tablet (and iPhones) and I can see all of my cameras in the C4 app (and I am using Blue Iris for what its worth)

2) Not a Z-Wave expert - someone else can chime in

3) Doorbell - Ring only lets events happen with a driver in control4 - so if someone rings the bell, you can say pause a TV or pause audio or something but you do not get the video/audio feed of the ring into a c4 environment.  With Doorbird, you can get the audio/video feed into C4 on a touchscreen using the intercom feature.  If you aren't going with C4 touch screens (point 1) not sure changing to a Doorbird gets you much in the world of C4 vs Ring in C4

[mod220]

42 minutes ago, eggzlot said:

1) Touch screens - any modern touchscreen is fine, but only the c4 touchscreens give you access to the intercom function.  Android, Fire, Apple, etc will let you load the c4 app but no intercom function.  Its a slight delay to wake up the tablet, launch/wait for the app to load, etc.  As far as not seeing cameras, that is false.  I have an iPad and I have an Android tablet (and iPhones) and I can see all of my cameras in the C4 app (and I am using Blue Iris for what its worth)

2) Not a Z-Wave expert - someone else can chime in

3) Doorbell - Ring only lets events happen with a driver in control4 - so if someone rings the bell, you can say pause a TV or pause audio or something but you do not get the video/audio feed of the ring into a c4 environment.  With Doorbird, you can get the audio/video feed into C4 on a touchscreen using the intercom feature.  If you aren't going with C4 touch screens (point 1) not sure changing to a Doorbird gets you much in the world of C4 vs Ring in C4

thank you, regarding the doorbell, would either the Doorbird or C4 Chime, allow the doorbell stream to show on the TV I'm watching?  Will the C4 Chime show up on a non-C4 tablet?

[eggzlot]

5 minutes ago, mod220 said:

thank you, regarding the doorbell, would either the Doorbird or C4 Chime, allow the doorbell stream to show on the TV I'm watching?  Will the C4 Chime show up on a non-C4 tablet?

You could get Doorbird or C4 Chime on a TV but you'll need some other hardware as well.  Depends on the TV, if you have any video matrix/distribution, etc.

You can see the video of a Chime or 1,000's of other cameras under the Camera section.  If you are talking about "when someone rings the door can I see the live video and talk to them...." on my phone/tablet.....  Within the C4 ecosystem, you can use a mobile phone or a C4 tablet (not a non C4 tablet) to do that 2 way communication with a Chime, DS2, Doorbird, any device from 2n and 1-2 other companies (But not Ring).

[mod220]

1 hour ago, eggzlot said:

You could get Doorbird or C4 Chime on a TV but you'll need some other hardware as well.  Depends on the TV, if you have any video matrix/distribution, etc.

You can see the video of a Chime or 1,000's of other cameras under the Camera section.  If you are talking about "when someone rings the door can I see the live video and talk to them...." on my phone/tablet.....  Within the C4 ecosystem, you can use a mobile phone or a C4 tablet (not a non C4 tablet) to do that 2 way communication with a Chime, DS2, Doorbird, any device from 2n and 1-2 other companies (But not Ring).

how does the doorbell connect to the controller/system?   the doorbell current runs to my basement via Cat 5 into a POE injector, but the controller is far away in the theatre cabinet, so I cannot physically connect them.

[eggzlot]

12 minutes ago, mod220 said:

how does the doorbell connect to the controller/system?   the doorbell current runs to my basement via Cat 5 into a POE injector, but the controller is far away in the theatre cabinet, so I cannot physically connect them.

which is why I mentioned you need some extra hardware involved.  I use Video Storm Netplay Video Matrix.  It can take any IP camera on the network and display it as PiP on any TV connected to the matrix.  All done via IP/networks.  I think there is an app called Toast that works on like LG or Samsung TVs, forget what OS TV you need.  Other video distribution systems could have their own way to do it.  If you have an NVR that has an HDMI output and that goes into a matrix you may be able to do something.  But I am fairly sure there has to be a device (on the network or directly attached) that will assist you with this task.

[zaphod]

21 hours ago, eggzlot said:

 I have an iPad and I have an Android tablet (and iPhones) and I can see all of my cameras in the C4 app (and I am using Blue Iris for what its worth)

I am primarily an iOS house, but I do have a Samsung Android tablet and I have used the Android app via Bluestacks.  My experience is that the C4 app launches significantly faster in Android compared to iOS.  Also when you click on the sessions button it comes up quicker in Android. Is that what you see as well?

[mod220]

19 hours ago, eggzlot said:

which is why I mentioned you need some extra hardware involved.  I use Video Storm Netplay Video Matrix.  It can take any IP camera on the network and display it as PiP on any TV connected to the matrix.  All done via IP/networks.  I think there is an app called Toast that works on like LG or Samsung TVs, forget what OS TV you need.  Other video distribution systems could have their own way to do it.  If you have an NVR that has an HDMI output and that goes into a matrix you may be able to do something.  But I am fairly sure there has to be a device (on the network or directly attached) that will assist you with this task.

Storm Netplay looks interesting, the website is rather comprehensive, it looks like the product is a unit and software license, are there annual/ongoing costs as well?  Unit is $600?   

A little confused how the GUI works, it says it runs through a fire stick as an example, so is the Netplay its on input device when using Control 4?  I am lost on how Roku (used for streaming and Spectrum cable TV) and Control4 and Netplay work together from an interface standpoint?

[eggzlot]

47 minutes ago, zaphod said:

I am primarily an iOS house, but I do have a Samsung Android tablet and I have used the Android app via Bluestacks.  My experience is that the C4 app launches significantly faster in Android compared to iOS.  Also when you click on the sessions button it comes up quicker in Android. Is that what you see as well?

I dont use blue stacks.  I have a Lenovo tablet and just installed the C4 app via the Play Store.  I use this less than 1x a month so honestly any feedback is rather minimal and not something I gauge often to know and compare vs the iOS app performance

[eggzlot]

31 minutes ago, mod220 said:

Storm Netplay looks interesting, the website is rather comprehensive, it looks like the product is a unit and software license, are there annual/ongoing costs as well?  Unit is $600?   

A little confused how the GUI works, it says it runs through a fire stick as an example, so is the Netplay its on input device when using Control 4?  I am lost on how Roku (used for streaming and Spectrum cable TV) and Control4 and Netplay work together from an interface standpoint?

Netplay can be DIY and it can be sold by a dealer.  So different hardware arrangements so its hard to answer in 1 easy sentence.

No real on going costs other than buying new hardware as needed and a license per TV so sure if you add more TVs there is an “on going cost” but there is no $99/year subscription model or anything in terms of those “on going” fees.

Long story short, you put sources (cable boxes, Roku, Apple TV, etc) into HDMI encoders, and then you use Sony TVs with Android or a Fire Stick or a NVIDIA Shield TV at the location of the tv and via the network it takes the HDMI signal and puts it on the TV for you.  Along with that, Video Storm can take an IP camera’s URL and display it as something on the TV too.  There are some demos on their website that show these features

@videostormcan chime in as well

[videostorm]

This easiest explanation in a C4 context is NetPlay is a network based video matrix, connecting all your sources to your displays.   It has a lot of advanced features that can PIP and tile sources, as well as graphical overlays from web / html5 sources.  Less expensive than most video matrix solutions, but still in the $1K range.  All perpetual licenses, no subscriptions.

If you aren't as interested in the video distribution part (sending your sources from a closet to your TVs via network), we also have SplashTiles (splash-tiles.com).  In C4 it is basically the graphical overlay stuff without the video distribution.  You can overlay buttons, cameras, web feeds, etc  over whatever is directly connected to the TVs.  SplashTiles is really inexpensive, but subscription based ($25 to $75/ yr)

[mod220]

1 hour ago, videostorm said:

This easiest explanation in a C4 context is NetPlay is a network based video matrix, connecting all your sources to your displays.   It has a lot of advanced features that can PIP and tile sources, as well as graphical overlays from web / html5 sources.  Less expensive than most video matrix solutions, but still in the $1K range.  All perpetual licenses, no subscriptions.

If you aren't as interested in the video distribution part (sending your sources from a closet to your TVs via network), we also have SplashTiles (splash-tiles.com).  In C4 it is basically the graphical overlay stuff without the video distribution.  You can overlay buttons, cameras, web feeds, etc  over whatever is directly connected to the TVs.  SplashTiles is really inexpensive, but subscription based ($25 to $75/ yr)

any videos specific to C4 and NetPlay?  My system does not have a home run, so I'm probably just interested in getting cameras and other overlay options on the screen.

[videostorm]

44 minutes ago, mod220 said:

any videos specific to C4 and NetPlay?  My system does not have a home run, so I'm probably just interested in getting cameras and other overlay options on the screen.

Yes, lots of them.  

White paper on c4 integration  https://video-storm.com/Downloads/why_netplay_c4.pdf

https://video-storm.com/residential.php   estimator and demo vids

My youtube channel has a lot more  https://www.youtube.com/user/videostorm1/videos     Keep in mind NetPlay is generally a superset of SplashTiles features, so both apply.

[mod220]

17 hours ago, videostorm said:

Yes, lots of them.  

White paper on c4 integration  https://video-storm.com/Downloads/why_netplay_c4.pdf

https://video-storm.com/residential.php   estimator and demo vids

My youtube channel has a lot more  https://www.youtube.com/user/videostorm1/videos     Keep in mind NetPlay is generally a superset of SplashTiles features, so both apply.

do I use the control 4 remote to navigate the splash tiles?  If my devices plug into the HDMI decoder, I assume I'll lose ARC (my wife and kids like just using the Roku remote for simplicity)?

[videostorm]

SplashTiles is controlled via the standard method for the device it runs on.  For example, if running on a Sony TV it is controlled via the Sony remote (or more accurately the Sony IP driver in C4).  So when the SplashTiles overlay is active (and interactive), you would select the Sony TV (watch) and the C4 remote can navigate the buttons.  

SplashTiles doesn't run on Roku, so if you go this route (and don't have an Android TV) I suggest replacing Roku with nVidia Shield  (or Fire stick if you prefer).  Then SplashTiles will just run on your primary streaming device, and either it's remote or the C4 remote will control it (and SplashTiles when active) without any complications.  

[mod220]

On 2/17/2022 at 11:10 AM, videostorm said:

SplashTiles is controlled via the standard method for the device it runs on.  For example, if running on a Sony TV it is controlled via the Sony remote (or more accurately the Sony IP driver in C4).  So when the SplashTiles overlay is active (and interactive), you would select the Sony TV (watch) and the C4 remote can navigate the buttons.  

SplashTiles doesn't run on Roku, so if you go this route (and don't have an Android TV) I suggest replacing Roku with nVidia Shield  (or Fire stick if you prefer).  Then SplashTiles will just run on your primary streaming device, and either it's remote or the C4 remote will control it (and SplashTiles when active) without any complications.  

I was running TiVO all over (cable + streaming)

Tivo didn't have enough apps (i.e. Disney) so I bought fire sticks for each TV

Tivo remotes started failing so I bought Roku since Fire Stick didn't have cable (Spectrum)

If I now go back to Fire Sticks, how will I get cable?  (tried YouTube TV and wife/kids didn't like it)

Always a kink!

[videostorm]

Seems like Spectrum TV app is on Google Play, so it would work on Shield or Chromecast (Google TV).

[mod220]

oh man i'm so tired of buying devices...

 

[eggzlot]

31 minutes ago, mod220 said:

oh man i'm so tired of buying devices...

 

Everyone said cord cutting would be better for the consumer 

though cable company hardware is trash, for decades you needed 1 box and got all of your content and life was grand.  now you need apps, subscriptions, different hardware, etc.

 

[RAV]

3 hours ago, mod220 said:

tried YouTube TV and wife/kids didn't like it

 

Work on that.
Left TIVO for YouTubeTV and never looked back. Was a charter member of Tivo.
Yeah there's no numbers, but you can custom the guide.

[Neo1738]

We still have cable and we use it maybe a few times a week. Idk we just like having the option I think.