Can a keypad dimmer control a non-dimmable load?

[DLite]

I have a couple of non-dimmable loads that are controlled by standard C4 switches. I'd like to replace the switches with keypads.  My understanding is that the configurable keypads won't control a load of any kind. However, the only other choices seem to be the adaptive phase or forward phase dimmer keypads.  Can those be made to work properly with non-dimmable loads?  My dealer says that the dimmer keypad just needs to be configured so that it turns on right away instead of ramping up.  My electrician, who has virtually no C4 experience, seems skeptical.  Will the dimmer keypad work in this setting?

[RyanE]

20 minutes ago, DLite said:

I have a couple of non-dimmable loads that are controlled by standard C4 switches. I'd like to replace the switches with keypads.  My understanding is that the configurable keypads won't control a load of any kind. However, the only other choices seem to be the adaptive phase or forward phase dimmer keypads.  Can those be made to work properly with non-dimmable loads?  My dealer says that the dimmer keypad just needs to be configured so that it turns on right away instead of ramping up.  My electrician, who has virtually no C4 experience, seems skeptical.  Will the dimmer keypad work in this setting?

It can IN SOME CASES work that way for non-dimmable lighting.  Anything other than lighting, definitely not, and even lighting, it's not 100% certain to work properly.

Best bet is to switch out the load for a dimmable load, even if you don't plan on dimming it.

Also keep in mind that even with a neutral they always put some power through the load even when the load is 'off', which can cause LED fixtures to glow if there isn't a large enough minimum load on the dimmer (LEDs can be so efficient they'll glow on almost no power).

The number of different LED fixtures and bulb configurations make this hard to predict if it will work or not.

RyanE

[Cyknight]

In other words, if it's a pre-fab light fixture (no replaceable bulbs) there is a decent change you'd be fine with a keypad dimmer, provided it's set to a minimum on of 99% and minimal ramp time. There's no guarantee mind you, though 'successrate' for those is high in my experience.

Fans etc, anything with a motor, computers (tvs) should never be on a dimmer to begin with.

[DLite]

1 hour ago, RyanE said:

It can IN SOME CASES work that way for non-dimmable lighting.  Anything other than lighting, definitely not, and even lighting, it's not 100% certain to work properly.

Best bet is to switch out the load for a dimmable load, even if you don't plan on dimming it.

Also keep in mind that even with a neutral they always put some power through the load even when the load is 'off', which can cause LED fixtures to glow if there isn't a large enough minimum load on the dimmer (LEDs can be so efficient they'll glow on almost no power).

The number of different LED fixtures and bulb configurations make this hard to predict if it will work or not.

RyanE

 

58 minutes ago, Cyknight said:

In other words, if it's a pre-fab light fixture (no replaceable bulbs) there is a decent change you'd be fine with a keypad dimmer, provided it's set to a minimum on of 99% and minimal ramp time. There's no guarantee mind you, though 'successrate' for those is high in my experience.

Fans etc, anything with a motor, computers (tvs) should never be on a dimmer to begin with.

Got it, thanks.  Currently, it has replaceable bulbs that are non-dimmable, so maybe it's best to swap it out for dimmable fixtures.

I guess another alternative is to leave the existing C4 switches in place and add configurable keypads that don't control the loads -- is that correct?

[RyanE]

1 hour ago, DLite said:

I guess another alternative is to leave the existing C4 switches in place and add configurable keypads that don't control the loads -- is that correct?

Yes, leaving the switches and adding additional boxes for keypads should work just fine, but be more 'wall clutter'.

RyanE

[RAV]

If it’s a three way circuit, you can replace the aux with a configurable keypad and leave the switch to control the load.

[drmark12pa]

Funny I have been wondering the same thing. I have lifx bulbs on a few circuits controlled with a dimmer switch which I leave in an on position all the time. I have set the ramp up rate to immediately and the off to immediately as well if I need to power them off to reset them. I'm actually going to be using a keypad dimmer to control a switched outlet which in turn will be controlling some LEDs for my sauna which are either on or off as well.

[Cyknight]

3 hours ago, drmark12pa said:

Funny I have been wondering the same thing. I have lifx bulbs on a few circuits controlled with a dimmer switch which I leave in an on position all the time. I have set the ramp up rate to immediately and the off to immediately as well if I need to power them off to reset them. I'm actually going to be using a keypad dimmer to control a switched outlet which in turn will be controlling some LEDs for my sauna which are either on or off as well.

Same problem, same answer really: you may be fine, likely will be, but it's not guaranteed - nor will it fall under warranty if it blows the dimmer of course.

Though in your case, if it's working fine on an existing dimmer, changing it to a keypad really won't change anything from the 'bulb's' perspective

[drmark12pa]

C4 should consider making a configurable keypad switch not just a dimmer.  Plenty of lights aren't really designed to be on a dimmer (ie outside lights, utility room, garage, pantry, entry) and having a configurable keypad at certain locations is ideal for alot of applications

[Cyknight]

22 hours ago, drmark12pa said:

C4 should consider making a configurable keypad switch not just a dimmer.  Plenty of lights aren't really designed to be on a dimmer (ie outside lights, utility room, garage, pantry, entry) and having a configurable keypad at certain locations is ideal for alot of applications

They have one on 240v: I suspect that the issue with a keypad switch in North America/110v is some form of certification/code problem.