Wall-mount hardwired key pad for a hardwired electrified door lock

[SYH]

We're putting in a narrow-stile aluminum door in this modern addition at a client's home.  It's commercial style door (made by Tube-lite) and thus has an electrified mortise lock (via Accurate Lock & Hardware) that is hardwired. I am trying to find a hardwired key pad that will mount on the wall next to the door that will work with this set up that does not have a camera or intercom. It would be great if it could integrate to Control 4 (at this point this is not a must, but a would be nice). Does such a device exist? This is quite unique for our region and has stumped all the trades.  This is the lockset - https://accuratelockandhardware.com/product/m1700e-motor-drive-electrified-narrow-backset-mortise-lock/

[RAV]

[SYH]

Is this exterior rated? And I assume Control 4 would allow you to program a sequence? Like NOPQ, ABCD, WXYZ

37 minutes ago, RAV said:

 

[RAV]

You would have to put it in a outdoor switch type box. It's an indoor keypad, can be AC or DC powered.

We did a closet with one of their pocket door locks, used words as the code. IE: u n l o c k (obviously not that one).

[SYH]

31 minutes ago, RAV said:

You would have to put it in a outdoor switch type box. It's an indoor keypad, can be AC or DC powered.

We did a closet with one of their pocket door locks, used words as the code. IE: u n l o c k (obviously not that one).

I like the AC/DC option. What company makes this style switch? Is it Lutron? I want to go back to the low-voltage and electrician crews with as much info as possible. Thank you so much.  

[Shoe]

Weird thread. Keypads for an electric lock shouldn't be confusing the "trades". Assuming someone intentionally purchased this door/lock and the house has other electric locks I would hope that a security company was involved. Is this the only door in the house with electric lock? Since this is a lock and not a strike is it wired through the hinge?

You don't want some goofy keypad next to a modern door. What does the client want?

I take it you are not the control4 dealer. GC for the addition?

[lippavisual]

I just did a bunch of these recently at a commercial project.  All of them however were tied back to an access control system.

Basically, run an 18/4 from any C4 controller with a relay to where the connection is on the door.

Youll need a 12v or 24v power supply (whatever the lock requires) to energize the lock.

Then you’ll have to wire the power supply between a contact and relay on the C4 controller.

A C4 keypad (dc or ac powered) can be installed to wirelessly control the lock through programming.

[SYH]

1 hour ago, Shoe said:

Weird thread. Keypads for an electric lock shouldn't be confusing the "trades". Assuming someone intentionally purchased this door/lock and the house has other electric locks I would hope that a security company was involved. Is this the only door in the house with electric lock? Since this is a lock and not a strike is it wired through the hinge?

You don't want some goofy keypad next to a modern door. What does the client want?

I take it you are not the control4 dealer. GC for the addition?

We're in a rural area so this is all just unknowns to the team. Commercial key pads were not working for the high-touch client.  I am not the GC.  

 

30 minutes ago, lippavisual said:

I just did a bunch of these recently at a commercial project.  All of them however were tied back to an access control system.

Basically, run an 18/4 from any C4 controller with a relay to where the connection is on the door.

Youll need a 12v or 24v power supply (whatever the lock requires) to energize the lock.

Then you’ll have to wire the power supply between a contact and relay on the C4 controller.

A C4 keypad (dc or ac powered) can be installed to wirelessly control the lock through programming.

Thank you!  

[Shoe]

But you are looking for an external keypad that will be exposed to the weather, yes?

[SYH]

8 minutes ago, Shoe said:

But you are looking for an external keypad that will be exposed to the weather, yes?

Yes! Does one exist ... beyond a plastic cover on a keypad made for interior use? 

[Shoe]

Does this house have any other doors with access control? Or is this the ONLY location in the house where you want some kind of keypad control.

What's your role on this addition?

[RAV]

Access Control system compatible with Control4, about $2000

https://www.blackwiredesigns.com/store/pdk-rdrmrk/
 

Linear, No integration, about $1300

https://linear-solutions.com/linear-keypads/

 

Standalone keypad you can hack like in the movies by shorting wires, $500.

[SYH]

8 minutes ago, Shoe said:

Does this house have any other doors with access control? Or is this the ONLY location in the house where you want some kind of keypad control.

What's your role on this addition?

This is the only door. It's an office on an ADU. There is a porch that is covered where the keypad will reside. The whole wall of the ADU on the porch is windows and glass door. The keypad will go on a side wall of the porch that is solid.  I'm the design project manager (I work for the residential designer) and am the voice for the client.  

[Shoe]

I like mullion mounts. This is stand alone. You could mount it on the door. Since it's glass I'm not sure security is really the concern.

 

https://linear-solutions.com/product/12-mullion-satin-standalone/

[Shoe]

If you went that way and want to integrate you could do it with the REX line and relay either on the controller or something else like a z2io/shelly etc. We assume you are running power to the door in some way.

[BDavisNJ]

how about use a standalone 2N keypad (https://www.2n.com/en_US/products/ip-access-control/2n-access-unit-2/2n-access-unit-2-touch-keypad)

And then use Chowmain's Generic TCP driver to communicate between the 2N and the C4? 

This is a great thread because the initial inquiry exposes a missing piece of C4's line-up: a driver that supports standalone keypads (Doorstations that do NOT have a camera).

[Shoe]

I'm not sure it exposes that. Most any stand alone keypad can be controlled by a relay. Control4 has many relay options as noted.

[SYH]

16 hours ago, BDavisNJ said:

how about use a standalone 2N keypad (https://www.2n.com/en_US/products/ip-access-control/2n-access-unit-2/2n-access-unit-2-touch-keypad)

And then use Chowmain's Generic TCP driver to communicate between the 2N and the C4? 

This is a great thread because the initial inquiry exposes a missing piece of C4's line-up: a driver that supports standalone keypads (Doorstations that do NOT have a camera).

Yes. This is the problem. Thank you! 

[Shoe]

If you want 2N the 2N Control4 driver probably works with the keypad. You would want to work with your Control4 integrator. Doesn't really sound like you have one. That 2N keypad also supports simply controlling it with a relay using the REX inputs (like most all controllers). With an electric lock that's the push to open button connection. If you have been in an office where they have electric locks you may have seen the button on the wall that you have to push to unlock the door to leave. That simply closes the contacts on the controller to open the lock. Using that with a relay and C4 would allow you to unlock the door using programming or the app etc.

It just depends on what the client wants from an aesthetic and functionality perspective and is willing to pay for really.

Does the main house have Control4?

[BDavisNJ]

@Shoe There is no guessing in home automation.  The 2N keypad that sits on the mounting panel for the DoorStation unit is an ancillary module and requires mating with the DoorStation unit for any communication or logic functions.  This element can not be mounted in isolation.  2N makes a separate, standalone unit that looks identical to the ancillary module and contains all of the needed electronics to function independently.  We need a driver for this unit; a Chowmain driver would be a wonderful addition ( @alanchow).  Chowmain drivers are fantastic and the programmers who author the drivers are top-notch.

 

The 2N product line looks sharp and has a solid feel (real metal, not plastic).  A few of the many reasons to select a standalone 2N keypad:

1. aesthetic consistency with existing 2N DoorStations
2. areas in which cameras would be inappropriate and intrusive
3. there are no existing keypad only products in the C4 lineup
4. ability to manage access codes from the same C4 Composer as DoorStations
5. security (resistant to brute force attack on the keypad)
6. quality, the 2N devices are consistent with high-end applications

@SYH I searched extensively and could not find a great solution absent using the workaround that I outlined above.  Let's hope that Chowmain identifies a business case to move forward (I did submit the driver request ticket).

[Shoe]

University professors are highly skilled at researching, synthesizing and presenting data. One thing that can get you fired from a university is plagiarism. Professors work very hard to appear to be the bearers of all knowledge in their students eyes. A lifetime of doing this does change your personality and when the job ends the vasana persists. This can leave one with a fragile psyche. It's not unlike a an AI LLM. An AI model seeks to encompass all things, but it's not human and has no soul. LLM's are desperate to answer questions and as a result can actually hallucinate or make up answers. AI models act a lot like professors in that they don't have any real life experience, but everyone looks to them for knowledge. AI models often do not cite the source of their knowledge and that's what makes them different from humans. Humans can chose to be ethical and honest and are often rewarded directly or indirectly by doing so.

 

If all we have is a hammer, everything looks like a nail.