sonic30101 Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 6 hours ago, swissglobalsolutions said: Yes they have become more relaxed and offering 15 rooms per account as far as I know plus you can set-up a pro account to manage multiple account and more easily change settings remotely. But if been frustrated several times with the limited functionality of the harmony remotes and that they don't offer proper control of software over IP. I've installed probably over 30 harmony remotes but am now looking into something more robust and my friend suggested Control4. What would be a good Control4 hub to buy first to use mainly as testing and proof of concept? I want to get on hands experience fist control4 first before I offer solutions with it to my clients. Any recommendation is appreciated An a EA1 is their entry level for AV and automation but is limited to 1 room for control so an EA3 is more ideal. You will have to be a dealer to have access to composer pro for programming though which doesn't give you time beforehand unless you buy a system, get it initially set up and you buy composer HE to get some access to the software side of things, I have installed quite a few harmony elites and control4 definitely wipes the floor with them when you have more than 2 rooms and if devices are shared with splitters or a matrix then it is way out of their wheelhouse due to limited IR ports as well as difficulty sharing 1 hub for 2 rooms becomes troublesome because certain parts of the activity macros that are generated cannot be deleted like turning off both zone1 and 2 of an avr without a lot of tweaking and tricking the remote to fire fake commands Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F0ZZ Posted February 17, 2018 Share Posted February 17, 2018 I chose C4 for two primary reasons. The onscreen display and physical remotes. My previous control system was Simple Control ( formerly Roomie Remote) which is primarily a DIY system. It has most of the capabilities of C4 for a lot less money. There are dealers who install this system and it can be programmed remotely, but set up is pretty easy so I would imagine this system is 99% DIY. No drivers to program, most products just work (IP, IR or serial). But without a physical remote, it’s uesability is lower than I wanted. In my mind C4 is a high end product that caters to people who don’t want to or can’t be bothered to set up their own automation system. It is certinally more powerful than most other offerings and Im happy to have a system in the works. But C4 needs to treat Alexa and other “smart home” products as competitors. If they don’t, they may find themselves in the same boat Kodac did when they didn’t take the digital revolution seriously. Apple HomeKit as another example connects to thousands of devices, it’s free, is easy to set up and works remotely. It isn’t a complete package however like C4. C4, stay on your toes! wappinghigh 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swissglobalsolutions Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 15 hours ago, sonic30101 said: An a EA1 is their entry level for AV and automation but is limited to 1 room for control so an EA3 is more ideal. You will have to be a dealer to have access to composer pro for programming though which doesn't give you time beforehand unless you buy a system, get it initially set up and you buy composer HE to get some access to the software side of things, I have installed quite a few harmony elites and control4 definitely wipes the floor with them when you have more than 2 rooms and if devices are shared with splitters or a matrix then it is way out of their wheelhouse due to limited IR ports as well as difficulty sharing 1 hub for 2 rooms becomes troublesome because certain parts of the activity macros that are generated cannot be deleted like turning off both zone1 and 2 of an avr without a lot of tweaking and tricking the remote to fire fake commands Thank you for the insight and comparison to the Harmonies. I'll look into it and try to get a EA3. Best Regards, David Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forum Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 I think Google is a competitor. They had a massive presence at CES this year. They seem to want to own the home space, and I think they are getting it. I see Google commercials on TV and more people know about Google Home than they do Control4 because of that. Google is set to release their Hello Doorbell in April. Apparently when the Doorbell recognizes a person's face, they announce "Person xyz is at the Door" over the Google Homes placed around the house. They will also send the doorbell stream to the chromecasts plugged into the TV's. This is all done without a programmer. I don't think Control4 can even do this. They are struggling to get something simple like two-way remote video communication working. I think there was a time and a place where Control4 was the smart home leader, but I could see Google, Amazon, Microsoft, and Apple taking that away very quickly with their marketing muscle and money power. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sonic30101 Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 I think Amazon and Google can put a dent in some things especially on the low and entry level, but distributed audio that isn't their native content and video? Nowhere close. And I doubt they will even try for it for a while if they ever do Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elvis Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 I've got some random thoughts on all of this. First is that I am amazed at the apathy for music quality and video quality. Tin can portable speakers are acceptable. SD TV displayed on HDTVs and the end user doesn't realize it isn't even HD. Overly compressed satellite sound and video -- these don't seem to bother most consumers. Until the number of consumers that want high fidelity sound and video increases, the door is open. Also, Amazon, Apple, and Google don't make any real infrastructure hardware. While Samsung makes everything but light switches (as far as I know), and if you considered their phones as voice controllers, they have all the bases covered. We'll they be a threat? They could be. If they got in bed with Bezos, they really could be a market threat from entry level to 1%ers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
therockhr Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 Control4 is trying to differentiate itself from the Alexa, google and other players by focusing on higher end audio and features for higher end homes. There is a market for those things but I don’t see it as a growing market but I don’t think they have any other choice. They can’t compete at the lower end with google and amazon so why try. sonic30101 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rsuryan Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 The thing I tell most of my clients is the cost of the controller is a small portion of a systems cost. It the sheer number of devices that add up, controllable switches and dimmers can get really expensive when there are 20-50-100 of them in a house. Motorized shades are pricey also. If C4 can address this part of the equation, something Amazon, Google, Apple are not directly involved in the whole ecosystem, when they get to that level then they can become a serious competitor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viperman Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 48 minutes ago, Elvis said: I've got some random thoughts on all of this. First is that I am amazed at the apathy for music quality and video quality. Tin can portable speakers are acceptable. SD TV displayed on HDTVs and the end user doesn't realize it isn't even HD. Overly compressed satellite sound and video -- these don't seem to bother most consumers. Until the number of consumers that want high fidelity sound and video increases, the door is open. Also, Amazon, Apple, and Google don't make any real infrastructure hardware. While Samsung makes everything but light switches (as far as I know), and if you considered their phones as voice controllers, they have all the bases covered. We'll they be a threat? They could be. If they got in bed with Bezos, they really could be a market threat from entry level to 1%ers. I have 10 HD TVs in my house and whenever we watch a TV series we watch it in SD. Don't care. Also, in my older age, sound doesn't really matter, I just need something loud enough to drown out the tinnitus. I honestly can't tell the difference between 1080 and 4K, I have looked time and time again. they look exactly the same to me. I went to a friends house for Super bowl and he had a 4K TV with cables all running down the wall to his cable box. Had alexa and would yell stuff at it and it worked pretty well. He was extremely happy with it and he set up everything himself very inexpensively. It is like buying a fast car. You can buy the fastest thing out today and tomorrow something is faster, better, and cheaper. So buy something you like that fits your budget and you will be good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msgreenf Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 I agree on the different in HD vs UHD...but I can totally tell the difference between SD and HD. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viperman Posted February 18, 2018 Share Posted February 18, 2018 4 minutes ago, msgreenf said: I agree on the different in HD vs UHD...but I can totally tell the difference between SD and HD. Give yourself 10 more years, and you will just try and figure out which wall the TV is on. sonic30101 and msgreenf 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
therockhr Posted February 28, 2018 Share Posted February 28, 2018 I mentioned this in another thread but this one may be better. Amazon is going to acquire Ring. This puts Amazon more into the hub/security market. As I mentioned before though, this doesn't necessarily make them a competitor to Control4. I don't see Amazon making something that will control the temperature of a wine cellar or an entrance gate. I don't even see Amazon or Google really trying to do integrated AV outside of just multi room audio through their speakers. What we are seeing is Amazon and Google filling the game for the middle class when it comes to HA and connectivity. Houses in the middle class don't need much in the way of automation outside of what they already have (people sometimes forget that even a $40 thermostat is automating your HVAC). What they really want is connectivity from their phone/tablet and the ability to create a few "scenes" but nothing too elaborate that could become a nuisance. Multi-million dollar residences are large enough that some more complex automation is helpful and a real time saver where as in a single family 3 bed 2 bath house its not a big deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aayush Arya Posted November 18, 2019 Share Posted November 18, 2019 Given the launch of the Echo Studio, I'm curious if anyone here thinks Amazon is continuing to encroach more and more on Control4's space? In configuring a client's 8 audio zones with an 8-zone matrix amplifier, I kept thinking to myself how much cheaper and simpler it would be with Echo speakers or even Echo Inputs connected to other speakers, all controlled through the Alexa app or voice commands. What do you guys think? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rjsuryan Posted November 18, 2019 Share Posted November 18, 2019 Control4 is going to come out with their own voice system in one to two years designed for home automation. Alexa is designed to sell you Prime, Google Home is designed to mine your data, and Homekit is designed to keep you in the Apple family. Control4 is not interested in the DIY market. Josh Ai is the only voice system designed for home automation right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elvis Posted November 18, 2019 Share Posted November 18, 2019 44 minutes ago, Aayush Arya said: Given the launch of the Echo Studio, I'm curious if anyone here thinks Amazon is continuing to encroach more and more on Control4's space? In configuring a client's 8 audio zones with an 8-zone matrix amplifier, I kept thinking to myself how much cheaper and simpler it would be with Echo speakers or even Echo Inputs connected to other speakers, all controlled through the Alexa app or voice commands. What do you guys think? Sonos maybe. Control4? I don't see it. Eight stereo zones would take 16 of those things. 16 Alexas to annoy you. msgreenf 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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