Suggestions on system

[Zappbranagan]

I am looking to get an idea of what I should purchase (hopefully secondhand on here) for a Control 4 system.

Here is my house

Living Room

LG 65” OLED

Onkyo -TX-777

Klipsch 7.2.4 speakers

Nvidia Shield

Xbox One X

PS4 Pro

Nintendo Switch

Sonos Play 5 (first gen)

Master Bedroom

Samsung 55” 4K (don’t know model off top of my head)

Sonos Play 3

Nvidia Shield

Kitchen and dining room

Sonos Play 1

Guest Room

Samsung 42” TV (don’t know model number off top of my head)

Nvidia Shield

Bedroom

Samsung 55” TV (don’t know model number off top of my head)

Nvidia Shield

Sonos Play 1

 

Lutron Caseta switches throughout the house (probably 40)

2 x Nest Thermostats

2 x Rheem Water heaters with EcoNet (not sure this can connect)

Garage Door (i dont have any sensors on it yet) and golf cart garage

I already have 2 x 260 remotes

I already have all my networking equipment (Ubiquity) and the house is wired for Cat6.

Overall, it is a pretty basic setup.  

 

My questions.  

1. For the time being, will an HC800 suffice for this setup for now?  I assume new hardware is coming out soon(ish), so would rather not buy new EA3 or 5 yet. from my understanding, the HC800 will work on 3.0, but will not allow any new GUI on any devices, correct?  

2. Sonos.  I am debating getting rid of Sonos and getting in ceiling speakers in each room and a switch/matrix.  Is this better for C4 or should i just stick with Sonos? 

3. Is the OSD really necessary?  Does anyone use it regularly?  If it is useful, you need a controller on each TV, correct?  I have Nvidia Shields on each TV now.  I mostly watch TV/Movies from my Plex server.

4. Garage Door sensors.  Any suggestions?  

 

Thank you!!!

[chopedogg88]

1- yes hc800 will suffice if you don't care about on-screen.  but who knows what else they will release soon which will only work on EA controllers.  I don't see them releasing a new controller any time soon but of course I could be wrong

2- Control4 matrix/amp works better with Control4 than Sonos for sure.  Its also more economical than adding a bunch of Sonos Connect AMPs.  The only thing I like better about Sonos is the ability to talk to Alexa and have it play whatever out of Sonos...although you could have that as an option if you added a Sonos Connect to a C4 matrix/amp setup.

3- Honestly I don't use it much.  Some people love it.  Yes you need an HDMI connection between controller and TV, if you have an HDMI matrix then you can get away with just one controller fed to all TVs but then people may end up fighting over that source (unlikely but can happen).

4- I like the NYCE tilt sensors, they work well and take 3 minutes to install (ID on zigbee mesh and then stick to door basically)

[LollerAgent]

16 minutes ago, Zappbranagan said:

4. Garage Door sensors.  Any suggestions?  

 

Do you have CAT5/6 ran to garage door and motor locations or do you need to go wireless?  What type of openers do you have?  This will depend on what solution will work best for you.

[Zappbranagan]

4 minutes ago, chopedogg88 said:

1- yes hc800 will suffice if you don't care about on-screen.  but who knows what else they will release soon which will only work on EA controllers.  I don't see them releasing a new controller any time soon but of course I could be wrong

2- Control4 matrix/amp works better with Control4 than Sonos for sure.  Its also more economical than adding a bunch of Sonos Connect AMPs.  The only thing I like better about Sonos is the ability to talk to Alexa and have it play whatever out of Sonos...although you could have that as an option if you added a Sonos Connect to a C4 matrix/amp setup.

3- Honestly I don't use it much.  Some people love it.  Yes you need an HDMI connection between controller and TV, if you have an HDMI matrix then you can get away with just one controller fed to all TVs but then people may end up fighting over that source (unlikely but can happen).

4- I like the NYCE tilt sensors, they work well and take 3 minutes to install (ID on zigbee mesh and then stick to door basically)

Thanks!  

 

 

[ekohn00]

1. I'd go with an EA, otherwise you'll always be wondering when the next one is coming.

2. I have 10 music zones in our house and to be honest that's a hard call. We end up streaming to either one or many zones, but almost never have more than one stream going at a time. If my house didn't come with the in-ceiling, I would have been happy going the Sonus route. I think you have to ask yourself how your environment is best served. You could also have a mixed environment.

3. 10 years and never used OSD on the TVs. All of which are wired in case someone wants to go crazy and push the red button......      Have a T3 in the kitchen that we use at times.

4. I use the Garage door package C4 has on the website. Been stable for the 10 years we've had them.

[eggzlot]

52 minutes ago, Zappbranagan said:

 

 

My questions.  

1. For the time being, will an HC800 suffice for this setup for now?  I assume new hardware is coming out soon(ish), so would rather not buy new EA3 or 5 yet. from my understanding, the HC800 will work on 3.0, but will not allow any new GUI on any devices, correct?  

2. Sonos.  I am debating getting rid of Sonos and getting in ceiling speakers in each room and a switch/matrix.  Is this better for C4 or should i just stick with Sonos? 

3. Is the OSD really necessary?  Does anyone use it regularly?  If it is useful, you need a controller on each TV, correct?  I have Nvidia Shields on each TV now.  I mostly watch TV/Movies from my Plex server.

4. Garage Door sensors.  Any suggestions?  

 

Thank you!!!

from my personal experience at my house:

1) its probably cheaper to get used HC800 and wait to buy a new EA whatever when they get released (my guess would be in the fall).  So if you cannot wait and have to do something now, it will cost a bit more (HC800 now plus something in a few months) but that something in a few months will have a longer life span than the EA3/5 you'll buy today and likely have better specs.

2) I had sonos and loved it but the changes in their API/partnerships made it more frustrating with C4.  I already had a mixed environment with c4 amp/video storm audio matrix in a few zones and sonos speakers in others, so I just went all in c4.  I did a home renovation project so during that time I added in ceiling speakers to any room where audio was needed.  makes announcements easier, the interface I know will work and will not be broken, etc.  Just peace of mind.

3) My wife uses the OSD at night to tinker with the HVAC settings when we get into bed.  that is about it.  It could be done via a touch screen we have in the room or our phones, but if we are in bed and lazy she uses the OSD.  that's it.  its a cool thing when demo'ing the system but in real life by the time you pick up the remote, hit the C4 button and navigate to what you want you can likely accomplish most of those tasks with keypad buttons, voice control, using your phone app, a touchscreen, etc.

4) I am using some generic hardwired door sensors that go into the old zigbee wireless contact sensor module.  That talks to C4.  I use the MyQ driver to open/close (and also reads the sensor state).

[msgreenf]

Just know you are buying old warranty less hardware that has been running for probably 5 years 24 x7 if you buy a used 800

Sent from my BBF100-2 using Tapatalk

[Zappbranagan]

29 minutes ago, msgreenf said:

Just know you are buying old warranty less hardware that has been running for probably 5 years 24 x7 if you buy a used 800

Sent from my BBF100-2 using Tapatalk
 

i get that.  But if I can get a 800 for $100 or so (which seems doable), get the system setup, then migrate to a new unit (if new hardware is coming out) that is worth the risk to me instead of dropping $1000-$2000 on a ea3 or ea5 that can be replaced with new hardware soon(ish).  

I posted a WTB for an Ea3.  There was one for sale recently for 500 with a controller, If I can get it around that price, it is a no brainer to just spend the more money and get the EA.  Thanks for the response. 

[chopedogg88]

My feeling is that if you are going to jump into Control4 to see if you like it, you might as well start with the latest & greatest so that you can get the best experience.  Personally I think it is much more likely that they will add additional functionality in the coming months that requires an EA controller, vs. the possibility of coming out with a new controller.  And if they do, you can always decide at that point if you want/need to upgrade, and your EA controller will be worth several hundred dollars still and you can always sell it to the next guy and recoup most of what you paid.  In the meantime you have the best experience and a controller that is under warranty in case of any problems so your investment is at least protected.

[eggzlot]

15 minutes ago, Zappbranagan said:

i get that.  But if I can get a 800 for $100 or so (which seems doable), get the system setup, then migrate to a new unit (if new hardware is coming out) that is worth the risk to me instead of dropping $1000-$2000 on a ea3 or ea5 that can be replaced with new hardware soon(ish).  

 

that is exactly what I meant when I said if you need to install today, but an HC800 as a stop gap until the new stuff is released.  Its not a long term solution but if today my Hc800 went down I'd buy another to replace it and wait for the new EA controllers to be released.  Id rather throw $100-$200 at 5 year old tech vs $1000 at 3 year old tech when something new is around the corner.

[chopedogg88]

You all know something I don't know about a new controller coming out? Or is this just pure speculation?

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[Zappbranagan]

I grabbed a used EA3 from a member here.  And i dont know anything about anything.  i am completely wet behind the ears on c4.  It just makes sense to me that they would have new hardware soonish to go alongside the new software.  pure speculation on my part.  Thanks everyone for the replies. looking forward to being a long time member here.

[LollerAgent]

2 minutes ago, Zappbranagan said:

I grabbed a used EA3 from a member here.  And i dont know anything about anything.  i am completely wet behind the ears on c4.  It just makes sense to me that they would have new hardware soonish to go alongside the new software.  pure speculation on my part.  Thanks everyone for the replies. looking forward to being a long time member here.

I wouldn't assume new hardware for controllers anytime soon really.. they just recently came out with the V2 version of the EA series.  Of course, I could be wrong.

[eggzlot]

2 minutes ago, chopedogg88 said:

You all know something I don't know about a new controller coming out? Or is this just pure speculation?

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speculation

looking at the time line of hc800 to the new EA controllers was a 4 year gap, and we are getting close to another 4 years.  The new OS mentions 4k and nothing on the EA's are 4k, etc.  They usually release stuff at events and CEDIA/ISE/CES (I know they do not do CES anymore but the HC800 was released at CES)

Jan 2012 - HC 800
Jan 2016 - EA Series release
Jan 2020 - EA 2/4/6??

Wouldn't it make sense ~4 years later, with a new OS and with nothing 4k, etc, that they would release a new controller?

[chopedogg88]

guess so...but I don't see how 4k on the controller is helpful?  for on-screen GUI which most people don't even use?

[c4toys]

1 hour ago, chopedogg88 said:

guess so...but I don't see how 4k on the controller is helpful?  for on-screen GUI which most people don't even use?

Now a controller/roku type devise, I could see great benefits to this!! Native video streaming??

[eggzlot]

could be they are getting into streaming media.  they are now in streaming audio offering pandora, siriusxm, deezer, tidal, etc.  why not offer netflix and amazon prime, etc in a box too?  Somewhere along one of these threads it was mentioned in notes or underlying code the ability to have OS 3 at 4k.  Not that it means C4 is releasing a media streaming box or adding video streaming to their controllers.  But 4k could be used for that, or OSD Navigation, or 4k cameras popping up on TVs, or just pure marketing hype to sell more controllers.  You need to upgrade because its 4k and customer says ok.  Just seems like a 4 year cycle so a hardware refresh is likely due.

[JSTRONG]

I will go against Ari and say we use the TV Navigator constantly. You just press a big red button. You never have to look at the remote to select what you want to watch. 

Plus its cool to look at your TV with quick access to things especially now with 3.0 press the red button and a favorite channel or garage door status,  alarm status , camera. All just 1 press away

 

 

[chopedogg88]

like I said...some people love it!  And I agree with OS3 it definitely takes on new life for sure.  I can see how 4K video would help for camera viewing.  I find it hard to believe that they will bundle streaming video into the Control4 controllers but one never knows...obviously not that difficult to do given how many devices have them built in (BluRay players, TVs, etc).

[ekohn00]

10 minutes ago, chopedogg88 said:

I find it hard to believe that they will bundle streaming video

Plex for android......just saying could be cool. Also justify 4k on new controller that may or may not every show up. Personally, would never use it. (Plex on c4 if it existed that is)

 

[ARDU]

3 hours ago, eggzlot said:

4. Garage Door sensors.  Any suggestions?  

Relay section on back of C4 controller can open and close garage door.  Run Cat5e/6 directly to wall switch from controller.  Rest is software.

[eggzlot]

25 minutes ago, chopedogg88 said:

I find it hard to believe that they will bundle streaming video into the Control4 controllers but one never knows.

i agree, but I would not have thought they would bundle streaming audio when I got into C4.  There was Sonos, Autonomic, Russound and who knows what else.  Grant it those are all $$$ items and adding a fire stick is cheap to get streaming sources on a TV.  No idea if they will do it but history shows they have tried to get more of the experience under their handle so who knows.

As you said, so many devices including cheap $200 TVs have these streaming apps, so would it be hard for C4 to put into their hardware too?

[Neo1738]

Only thing with streaming video is for those on matrix setup can't use OSD if it's showing video in another room. Would lose some functionality in that situation. I would think more for 4k cameras or the like. 

[Zappbranagan]

Thanks for all the replies.  

A few questions.

I am putting a EA-3 in a central location with my current network gear.  

1.  Nvidia Shield.  I have this at each TV, not in the AV/Network location.  Is the IRUSB the best for control of these?  

2.  Switches.  Recommended switch for network.  I currently have a ubiquity 48 port managed switch.  No POE.  Is this fine? 

3. Wifi.  I use Google Wifi right now.  Have had no issues with them.  Any reason I have to change?  Only thing on wifi right now is my phone and tablets

4. Speaker recommendations.  I am going to go the route of ceiling and wall speakers, instead of sonos.  What do i need for this?  Just speakers and audio matrix?  Is the matrix amplified, or do i need an amplifier, then a matrix.  I only have 6-8 zones that I need audio for.  Is the monoprice 6 zone any good? 

Thanks!

[Amr]

1. Yes

2. Managed switches are not recommended by C4 but I do have a Cisco Managed Switch and it works fine with C4, just make sure u turn off spanning tree, QoS, etc.

3. Google WiFi is a mesh system and it’s not supported with C4, If you can lay down Cat6 to a centralized location, then Go UiFi AP’s, they are not supported by C4 thought but works for me without any issue.

4. No monoprice please, rubbish by all means, your don’t spend 1000’s and on a vital component you introduce a piece of garbage, am sorry for this but my experience with monoprice is really bad, totally unpredictable performance and a very bad aftersales Support, go with any other reputable brand C4 8x8 or a compatible one, that’s my 2 cents.