You dealers who hang it on me on this forum are a total bunch of losers!!!!

[eggzlot]

^ Wrong.

 

Spotify is way more complicated than Control4...

 

It has hundreds of millions of users..  Millions and millions of lines of code..

 

It links with facebook and several other company apps.. It is now managed and controlled within every users network and home.. All from the cloud..

 

It can be operated on multiple platforms. All upgradeable in a second.. by the end user...

 

It's now embedded in dozens of third party products. Somehow a little Scandinavian company that started off smaller than C4 managed to do that..

 

Control4 tried once. (with Sony) and every user who bought that product paid for it.. 

 

Control4 links with 1,000s of other applications.  Control4 has users across the world.  I think you are beating a dead horse.  A music streaming service is not comparable with a home automation system.  They are different beasts.  Spotify has 1 thing to worry about, a streaming service.  All R&D goes into that 1 item.  Control4 has a platform that covers 10,000s of items.  I am not saying one R&D shop is better than the next, I am saying they are different beasts.

[msgreenf]

Wap, bottom line talk is cheap. It's easy to point out flaws. Go do it better. Raise capital. Be CEO. Compete

Sent from my XT1060 using Tapatalk

[Brownbatsbreath]

Seriously. I know I'm new here, but im confused. I know it's not a spotify thread, but the dude admitted spotify sparked his rant, so...

Like, what is he so amazed at... He can stream spotify on some pioneer junk and use the spotify app?! My technology challenge fiancé does that daily with a WMB. For quite some time now. Software even auto updates... No need to click a button at 11 pm. What am I missing?

[Cyknight]

Seriously. I know I'm new here, but im confused. I know it's not a spotify thread, but the dude admitted spotify sparked his rant, so...

Like, what is he so amazed at... He can stream spotify on some pioneer junk and use the spotify app?! My technology challenge fiancé does that daily with a WMB. For quite some time now. Software even auto updates... No need to click a button at 11 pm. What am I missing?

 

The glorious spark that Wap has yet to enlighen us with.

[wappinghigh]

Seriously. I know I'm new here, but im confused. I know it's not a spotify thread, but the dude admitted spotify sparked his rant, so...

Like, what is he so amazed at... He can stream spotify on some pioneer junk and use the spotify app?! My technology challenge fiancé does that daily with a WMB. For quite some time now. Software even auto updates... No need to click a button at 11 pm. What am I missing?

LOL. That You can't do this with Control4. Because of the dealer only model. That is *entirely* the point. LOL. Can wifey pop in that WMB and get another on ebay if likes it herself? From some other customer who doesn't need one anymore? You have a lot to learn! I'm happy to sit here and counterpoint. On this thread only. It will be my last. Becuase it's the right thing to do. And I can't help anyone anymore. Because at the end of the day this model sucks. As it currently stands. Period That's it. 

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[wappinghigh]

Yes. Guess what? It not only sucks for me. It sucks for dealers as well...

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[Mark LaBelle]

No offense whatsoever Wap, but didn't you leave like 5 times today and on other posts.  I like you here, but you can't keep saying you are leaving....

[wappinghigh]

Yep leaving alright. Just can't help responding to pure ignorance that's all. Enough said. Goodbye.

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[Mark LaBelle]

Well, we'll miss you! 

[qVAMPIREp]

Well, we'll miss you!

Your parents must be really proud son....

[Mark LaBelle]

Your parents must be really proud son....

They are dead, but yes, I'm sure they are.  I'm not really sure what I said, but I will miss Wap.

[Brownbatsbreath]

LOL. That You can't do this with Control4. Because of the dealer only model. That is *entirely* the point. LOL. Can wifey pop in that WMB and get another on ebay if likes it herself? From some other customer who doesn't need one anymore? You have a lot to learn! I'm happy to sit here and counterpoint. On this thread only. It will be my last. Becuase it's the right thing to do. And I can't help anyone anymore. Because at the end of the day this model sucks. As it currently stands. Period That's it.

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Actually, I think the WMB pretty much works stand alone, so... If she could plug it in to a receiver, she'd be good to go....

Anyway, my point is focus more on facts instead of volume maybe. Customer feedback is extremely valuable. Constant rants are just annoying.

[Mark LaBelle]

Yep leaving alright. Just can't help responding to pure ignorance that's all. Enough said. Goodbye.

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I think we should start a new thread called, "what day will Control4 (CTRL) be delisted from the exchange?"  Short that puppy, eh?  Seriously, if you are so concerned, short it and make a killing!  My advice would be to short it on the next call.  And for most of us, we have so much disposable income we spend it on Control4 - how strange.  We are all morons and losers according to you.   I'm semi-retired at 44 after selling off my tech consulting company 4 years ago.  I work partially now, but it's for fun and to get our of my wife's hair, but in all honesty, go with your gut.  I've actually toyed and many here have heard it from me - that I would create a killer C4 Global VAR.  But that might just still happen. 

 

Control4 has a long way to go, but for all the amalgamated HA products, Control4 has it!  Now to get the Consumer to understand the difference between pure single automation and integration is a whole different ballgame!

 

http://seekingalpha.com/article/2963256-control4-no-control-of-its-destiny

[Gary Leeds UK]

Mark, 

 

Wapp issue is that he loves C4, but like many of use struggles with dealer only model. 

 

We can see they is a place for dealers and DIY guys, however most dealers do not see this and like

some of us he is scared C4 will go backwards . 

 

Wapp if I got that wrong sorry 

[msgreenf]

Mark,

Wapp issue is that he loves C4, but like many of use struggles with dealer only model.

We can see they is a place for dealers and DIY guys, however most dealers do not see this and like

some of us he is scared C4 will go backwards .

Wapp if I got that wrong sorry

It's easy to not see it as a dealer product when you don't believe the reasons it's a dealer product. It's still semi complex to setup and program. Wap doesn't want to believe that. Has sddp and each release make it less complex? A little. But it's just not ready for anyone without training to install.

I could see that changing if sddp catches on. But it's just not there.

If you had to take mandatory week long training would you still think it was diy? Would you take time off from work to do so?

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[msgreenf]

And I am also sick of hearing wap complain about the number of ts apps at launch. How many apps did iOS 1 have? That's right 0 third party apps

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[Gary Leeds UK]

It's easy to not see it as a dealer product when you don't believe the reasons it's a dealer product. It's still semi complex to setup and program. Wap doesn't want to believe that. Has sddp and each release make it less complex? A little. But it's just not ready for anyone without training to install.

I could see that changing if sddp catches on. But it's just not there.

If you had to take mandatory week long training would you still think it was diy? Would you take time off from work to do so?

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You assume that a Diy person wishes to set the system up - your wrong

We understand dealers do training and they are able to enhance C4 - we just wish to change and add components.

Hence why I say both can work hand in hand.

Yes I have use Pro and it's not hard ( to help a dealer out)

all business need customers and HA is going to be a big business, however at the moment, C4 could be left behind.

That's what we find frustrating

[South Africa C4 user]

Perhaps enhancing what is available in HE would sort much of the problem out. I also tend to like DIY, but definitely see the benefits of a dealer. For instance, I have sat with my dealer while we have bound lights and switches together. Neither he nor I saw why this should not be in HE. Similarly loading a driver into the project seems quite easy and could be in HE. These two items for me would make me ecstatic with HE and have no desire for Pro. I have also watched my dealer work with IR codes etc. and this was way over my head and it is definitely safer for me not to have access to this!

[Mark LaBelle]

It's easy to not see it as a dealer product when you don't believe the reasons it's a dealer product. It's still semi complex to setup and program. Wap doesn't want to believe that. Has sddp and each release make it less complex? A little. But it's just not ready for anyone without training to install.

I could see that changing if sddp catches on. But it's just not there.

If you had to take mandatory week long training would you still think it was diy? Would you take time off from work to do so?

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Maybe not take time off for onsite weeklong training, but I sure would invest the time, as would many others I know - not just here on this forum.  You can deliver training in a variety of mediums.  Doesn't have to be a week long, onsite training.  I certainly spent way more than a week learning the ins and outs of building a sound isolated room and there is a whole forum dedicated to just that.  So you can't say just because it's complex, it's not worth the investment. 

[Billiam]

I'm an end user.  I've purchased 5 different sprinkler control units over the past few years (RainMachine, Irrigation Caddy,  CyberRain...) looking for one I actually liked and was reliable. My latest unit is the Rach.io - the best so far.

 

To interact with C4 I had to buy an $125 driver. It took a week for my dealer to come by and hook it up. The next day it stopped working because he left in the trial version of the driver. So I had to play phone tag with the dealer. 3 days later it finally worked.  But C4 was displaying the names of the various zones in the wrong order. There was no way to change them myself because they were hand-coded in via Composer Pro. The Composer HE couldn't change their names. Another round of phone tag.    $150 dollars, 4 or 5 phone calls and 6 days to get the connection up and running.

 

I then read that the Rach.io can interact with my NEST thermostat. (if there's a fire, the sprinklers will automatically turn on...)  So I went into the Rach.io's settings, found a button "INTERACT with NEST" and typed in my Nest account info.  BOOM.  5 seconds and everything was taken care of.  No telling Rachio where my Nest thermostat was, no typing in serial numbers... Nothing.  It just worked.

 

THAT's what's needed more with Control 4.  I should've been able to go into my C4 account on the Internet, type in my Rach.io info that everything should just happen. 

 

I understand the arguments on both sides. But as an end-user, THAT is what I want. 

[AK1]

I do think this is more a reflection on dealer practices than the overall Control4 model. Would you have been happy if your dealer did the work online within 24 hours of the request and (if any end user interaction was required at all) you would be at the home on the phone to change any settings or whatever on the Ranch.io?

Of course there are always those users who just want it fixed and don't want to be involved, just like paying someone to mow the lawn.

[Brownbatsbreath]

Totally agree on the dealer practices assessment. These stories of frustrating experiences are valuable feedback, and shouldnt go ignored. What i think doesnt help, is starting a flame war with the small percentage of dealers and tech support who care enough about the pulse of current customers to come on this forum and provide help. 

 

Its probably actually pretty counterproductive to this guy's cause. Lets see, someone who cant figure out that Control4 doesnt manufacture any network switches, and therefor cant control the noise level the fans of 3rd party switches make,  wants full access to all set up features. (which im not for or against one way or the other, btw) Now imagine the reaction and feedback he'll give when he screws up some bindings and cant get his spotify to play. I wouldnt want to open up something to a customer like that, knowing he could sink his own system and bash my company when he goes nuclear. 

 

We've all seen the same complaints about lackluster dealers on here over and over. Unfortunately, those aint the cats on here. They sure arent anybody in position to control or influence business practices outside of their own dealerships.  

[cdepaola]

Totally agree on the dealer practices assessment. These stories of frustrating experiences are valuable feedback, and shouldnt go ignored. What i think doesnt help, is starting a flame war with the small percentage of dealers and tech support who care enough about the pulse of current customers to come on this forum and provide help. 

 

Its probably actually pretty counterproductive to this guy's cause. Lets see, someone who cant figure out that Control4 doesnt manufacture any network switches, and therefor cant control the noise level the fans of 3rd party switches make,  wants full access to all set up features. (which im not for or against one way or the other, btw) Now imagine the reaction and feedback he'll give when he screws up some bindings and cant get his spotify to play. I wouldnt want to open up something to a customer like that, knowing he could sink his own system and bash my company when he goes nuclear. 

 

We've all seen the same complaints about lackluster dealers on here over and over. Unfortunately, those aint the cats on here. They sure arent anybody in position to control or influence business practices outside of their own dealerships.  

 

 

So you have 4 posts and you chime in like you've been here for years?  Funny how those bashing WAP tend to be dealers and those saying they are going to miss him happen to be end users.  

[therockhr]

I became interested in C4 about 4 years ago when researching home automation products. One thing that caught my eye was that instead of having integrators create custom GUI's that looked like something out of Star Trek, they had a standard GUI that looked good and was consistent throughout the entire interface. Since then all the other major players have done the same and have a default GUI. The other thing that C4 did was market their system like crazy. Engadget actually had an article about a C4 starter kit. This marketing blitz gave me the impression that while it wasn't a DIY system, that it wouldn't be discouraged; this was definitely not the case.

 

Just wanted to give a little insight on why C4 caught my eye and I used it for a short period.

 

I have totally moved on to Roomie Remote and am really happy with it. Even my wife likes it. There was a time I had C4 and Roomie Remote controlling the system side by side. The Roomie app blew away the C4 iOS app. The only thing my wife and I miss is the hard remote for the TV areas but once I told her the cost difference she was more than willing to make due without it.

 

With Roomie I have all my AV integrated and hope to eventually work with them to get my security system integrated. From my Roomie Remote app I can:

• browse and play the recorded shows on my Dish Hopper DVR
• Browse TV listings for Dish and go to the show or record the show all from the Roomie app
• Browse and play content from my AppleTV
• Browse and play music from my Sonos to my Denon AVR zones or Russound MCA-C5 zones

My next step is to invest in either a Lutron SmartBridge Pro or Lutron RadioRa 2 system. Both of these systems integrate perfectly with Roomie. Also, Roomie is working on a small controller that will allow remote access and some other features. One of them is being able to control Roomie functions from a Lutron keypad.

 

This leads me to my point; it's time for the DIYer's on here like myself to move on and push the upstart's to keep adding more features. They are more willing to listen and are catering to our segment more than C4. C4 is not for someone who likes to tinker, it is made for a dealer to install and the consumer to use as is. It doesn't have to be but that is the model they are using.

[therockhr]

I have also noticed in other threads where people talk about "lots of negativity on here recently". What do you really expect from the end users on this site? The end users who get on here research and talk about their system constantly. They figure out ways they can make it better or things they can do or buy to enhance the system. Then once they have finally figured out the best way to implement what they want they have to call up a dealer and explain exactly what it is they want, hope that they have time or want to do it and then shell out money to do something that you could have easily done theirselves in half the time. If you can't see how that is frustrating and could cause negative feelings then I don't know what else to say.

 

But as I mentioned before, the DIYer's need to move on. If your system is AV only and you don't mind to be iPad only, then the solutions are out there and honestly are better (especially when it comes to media management).