MyMovies Abandons Control4 API Access for End users in next revision MM5.0

[SMHarman]

And this is where it becomes more ideal to have only the server device, because some of the functionality of the device will not be as user friendly if the device is not on.

 

Examples are that you at all times can have the mobile devices connected to the server or ripping device, whatever device you choose it to be, and you can see lists of what have copied, the statuses of these, and, you can then directly play the converted titles on the mobile device, or, play it on a Chromecast or similar.

 

If you have a device that is not always on, that is at least not as simple as when the device is on.

 

Agreed that we might need to consider this an area to extend our wake on lan features.

 

OK, have you used the C4/EV/Popcorn (or similar) solution?  The point is that it does not need the MM aspect to be always on.  Your 'idea' of how that works, and the benefits of having your apps access the device are one thing, but one of the reasons to build a C4 solution is to get away from the one app for the smart tv, one for the tivo, one for the bluray, one for the AVR etc and have Control4 all the devices in one remote, OSD, touchscreen, app. 

 

The EV solution is just as friendly whether the MM device is on or off.

[Binnerup]

OK, have you used the C4/EV/Popcorn (or similar) solution?  The point is that it does not need the MM aspect to be always on.  Your 'idea' of how that works, and the benefits of having your apps access the device are one thing, but one of the reasons to build a C4 solution is to get away from the one app for the smart tv, one for the tivo, one for the bluray, one for the AVR etc and have Control4 all the devices in one remote, OSD, touchscreen, app. 

 

I am aware how it works - it uses the API to populate a Control4 internal database.

 

This is fine, and you can choose to do that - all I am saying here is that you are loosing out on features if that is all you do.

 

If you want to play stuff, you naturally need to have the device it plays from powered on - as mentioned, I agree here that we perhaps should look at extending our wake on lan features, which we have in relation to our Windows Media Center solution, where the mobile applications remote control part can power on and off the Windows Media Center PC - this potentially can be extended to do the same for a ripping device if you request to play something or similar.

[SMHarman]

I am aware how it works - it uses the API to populate a Control4 internal database.

 

This is fine, and you can choose to do that - all I am saying here is that you are loosing out on features if that is all you do.

 

If you want to play stuff, you naturally need to have the device it plays from powered on - as mentioned, I agree here that we perhaps should look at extending our wake on lan features, which we have in relation to our Windows Media Center solution, where the mobile applications remote control part can power on and off the Windows Media Center PC - this potentially can be extended to do the same for a ripping device if you request to play something or similar.

 

I'm sure my SmartTV manufacturer says I am losing out on features as I just use it as a dumb display, by BD player mfr is saying I am losing out on features because I only play BDs/DVDs in it and don't use the inbuilt netflix but instead use Roku.  Control4 may even say I am losing out on features as I don't use the comfort or security menus.

 

A PopBox has WOL so while it does need to be on, it can be on in low power mode so in the C4/EV/Popbox/Synology arrangement the C4 HC is on (which it needs to be anyway), the Popbox and Synology can be WOL by the C4 when you choose to watch a movie.

[Binnerup]

A PopBox has WOL so while it does need to be on, it can be on in low power mode so in the C4/EV/Popbox/Synology arrangement the C4 HC is on (which it needs to be anyway), the Popbox and Synology can be WOL by the C4 when you choose to watch a movie.

 

This is not really the player I am talking about here - your NAS device needs to be on to play through it, just like a My Movies based server needs to be.

 

If you transform that to the ripping device, if the ripping device should serve the files when playing from a mobile device, it needs to be on. Be aware that playback on mobile devices is not just an SMB access to a NAS device,

 

I think though that this discussion is somewhat of topic - I suggest that you create a post on our forums, or contact us on support (at) mymovies.dk if you need more details.

[ILoveC4]

I've created several threads on your forum, and not received replies.  I'll ask my question here.

 

Currently I use MyMovies to add movies to my NAS, track what movies I have, and to populate the Control4 database so my family and I can watch movies.

 

My wife or I sit down at a PC in my home, which has MyMovies installed.  We open the MyMovies app, and drop in the disc we want to burn.  It pops up saying something along the lines of "Disc WHATEVER YOU WANT was inserted, would you like to copy?".  I hit copy, then hit start.  A few minutes later the movie is ripped to my NAS, the coverart is in my Control4 system and my family can watch the movie.

 

I don't have to leave the PC on, or anything like that. 

 

WILL THIS FUNCTIONALITY CHANGE? I DON'T CARE ABOUT WHAT COOL STUFF I'M LEAVING OUT BY NOT HAVING A DEDICATED $5,000+ DD SERVER (OR SOMETHING OF THE LIKE) THAT IS ALWAYS ON.

 

Man - I wish you luck in educating your user base on this.  I think you've got a tough road ahead of you.

[Binnerup]

WILL THIS FUNCTIONALITY CHANGE? I DON'T CARE ABOUT WHAT COOL STUFF I'M LEAVING OUT BY NOT HAVING A DEDICATED $5,000+ DD SERVER (OR SOMETHING OF THE LIKE) THAT IS ALWAYS ON.

 

That will change, yes, but you can configure it to copy the inserted disc automatically, or you can configure it to prompt, similar to what you are currently doing.

 

The main difference is that the copy process is in a background service, which sends out notifications, and not a manual process on screen.

 

So, you will see a difference in how it operates, but you will have the same functionality.

[Cyknight]

 

WILL THIS FUNCTIONALITY CHANGE? I DON'T CARE ABOUT WHAT COOL STUFF I'M LEAVING OUT BY NOT HAVING A DEDICATED $5,000+ DD SERVER (OR SOMETHING OF THE LIKE) THAT IS ALWAYS ON.

 

I think this thread has gotten filled with sidetracks making the whole thing hard to read.

 

As I can see it, functionality wise nothing really changes. Those that have something now that is (according to MyMovies) technically incorrect will be looked after. From here on you need a pro licensed version for MyMovies to do what you need to do (in respect to the EV driver/Control4) vs buying a bunch of points (and as far as I can tell this won't really end up any more expensive, if at all).

 

Agree with the change or not, it seems as if the impact is fairly minimal IRL, though perhaps the intend is to steer away from "end-user" PCs to dedicated units for the purpose, be they 'specialized' computers to run MyMovies on demand, HTPC units running MyMovies for ripping, playing but not storage or 'smart servers' that incorporate ripping, storage and MyMovies,

[Cyknight]

Oh, and yes I very much agree that this is going to take quite a bit of explaining to many current users, both in- and outside the Control4 group that happens to be MyMovies users as well.

 

Time will tell what the overall effects will end up being.

 

One would ALMOST start thinking like Wap and say that everything should just be free and unprotected.

[chesterwilson]

This will not end well.

 

Marketing 101

 

Good luck

[turls]

This will not end well.

 

 

Making this kind of change simultaneously with doing a major re-write....yikes.  And like I said, I've had very spotty support in the past as is.

[SMHarman]

This will not end well.

Marketing 101

Good luck

I agree, if we are talking sets and subsets, those using the MM media management and EV driver are not a subset of those that will buy an integrated media server.

Unjust want a cheap way to ditch the DVDs. Perhaps I should buy the 777ES someone had for sale on here and be done with it.

At least Sony does not nerd me to find a licenced Sony dealer to integrate it. Any C4 dealer could remote in ans install the driver!

Sent from my LT26i using Tapatalk

[SMHarman]

That will change, yes, but you can configure it to copy the inserted disc automatically, or you can configure it to prompt, similar to what you are currently doing.

The main difference is that the copy process is in a background service, which sends out notifications, and not a manual process on screen.

So, you will see a difference in how it operates, but you will have the same functionality.

Thing is this is a lesser used feature and you are touting this upgrade as a benefit.

The feature we care about lightweight media management is being crippled.

Sent from my LT26i using Tapatalk

[cdepaola]

This will not end well.

 

Marketing 101

 

Good luck

 

I agree it will not end well, as the general MyMovies community is DIY based and your now telling them sorry while we have primarily served you for years we wont any more.  This is MyMovies "Jump the Shark" moment. 

 

Personally I won't be upgrading or suggesting this to clients as of this time. 

[ILoveC4]

That will change, yes, but you can configure it to copy the inserted disc automatically, or you can configure it to prompt, similar to what you are currently doing.

The main difference is that the copy process is in a background service, which sends out notifications, and not a manual process on screen.

So, you will see a difference in how it operates, but you will have the same functionality.

So what happens with this "automated process" when My Movies doesn't recognize the disc? Like when I copied the new Hunger Games movie last week and it didn't know what it is and I have to manually type in the movie name?

Sent from my Droid MAXX via Tapatalk.

[Binnerup]

So what happens with this "automated process" when My Movies doesn't recognize the disc? Like when I copied the new Hunger Games movie last week and it didn't know what it is and I have to manually type in the movie name?

 

Then it adds a title with the label of the disc, and no data automatically to the collection.

 

You can then either use the "Change Data" option to search for the title, or you can use the "Report Unidentified Disc" option to report it as missing to our staff, and the system will then automatically apply the data to the profile once it becomes available in the service.

 

We are curently working on improving these functionalities, so that the tasks can be performs through a mobile device, if the user prefers that.

[Cyknight]

At least Sony does not nerd me to find a licenced Sony dealer to integrate it. Any C4 dealer could remote in ans install the driver!

 

 

And any dealer will still be able to install the driver for the MyMovies info transfer to Control4. This is NOT going to change. What changes is that the devices that can run the 'correct' version of MyMovies change/undergo a change/need to come from somewhere else.

 

Sony still decides who can sell the Sony disc changer (or in this case if they even sell them at all anymore).

 

The part that I've been trying to stress here for several posts now is that the change is solely on how to obtain the device running the MyMovies management/how to obtain the 'correct' version of MyMovies management, NOT who can or cannot make that set-up, once in place, work for you.

 

ANY Control4 dealer who is also an EV dealer can install the drivers and set-up the drivers - but they may or may not be able to MAKE you the device that runs MyMovies. They can still make it work if you already have one, or buy a licensed device from someone who makes them for you.

[ILoveC4]

Then it adds a title with the label of the disc, and no data automatically to the collection.

 

You can then either use the "Change Data" option to search for the title, or you can use the "Report Unidentified Disc" option to report it as missing to our staff, and the system will then automatically apply the data to the profile once it becomes available in the service.

 

We are curently working on improving these functionalities, so that the tasks can be performs through a mobile device, if the user prefers that.

So, what does it call the folder that it saves the files in?  How do you go about finding this in MyMovies when you're using a "headless device" to rename it properly?

I think I'll just stick with what I have and quit recommending MyMovies to people until this garbage gets sorted out, if it ever does.  It's a real shame too, because it's been a good product thus far.

[SMHarman]

And any dealer will still be able to install the driver for the MyMovies info transfer to Control4. This is NOT going to change. What changes is that the devices that can run the 'correct' version of MyMovies change/undergo a change/need to come from somewhere else.

 

Sony still decides who can sell the Sony disc changer (or in this case if they even sell them at all anymore).

 

The part that I've been trying to stress here for several posts now is that the change is solely on how to obtain the device running the MyMovies management/how to obtain the 'correct' version of MyMovies management, NOT who can or cannot make that set-up, once in place, work for you.

 

ANY Control4 dealer who is also an EV dealer can install the drivers and set-up the drivers - but they may or may not be able to MAKE you the device that runs MyMovies. They can still make it work if you already have one, or buy a licensed device from someone who makes them for you.

 

I guess if I were doing this, and as stated, all the changes planned were discussed with EV, then why not make EV the licenced partner who provides an installation payload appropriate for the product ordered rather than add another set of hoops for dealers.  Afterall, EV are troubleshooting these installations at present where dealers get into trouble.

 

EV could then sell a driver plus a branded copy of MM to the dealer and supervise / troubleshoot the installation process.

 

MM then doesn't have to deal with a blob of new dealers who do 2,3,10 of these installs but with EV that would do many and moves the troubleshooting to EV who have a good troubleshooting system, not to MM who it seems from comments here, do not.

 

It also stops the fingerpointing between EV, C4, MM and relevant hardware as to who owns the problem.  Now the dealer works with EV to get this working, go forward, you have another party in the mix.

 

I doubt any dealer considers MM licences a useful revenue stream, just another licencing arrangement to pay up front for and then maintain etc.

[cdepaola]

The part that I've been trying to stress here for several posts now is that the change is solely on how to obtain the device running the MyMovies management/how to obtain the 'correct' version of MyMovies management, NOT who can or cannot make that set-up, once in place, work for you.

ANY Control4 dealer who is also an EV dealer can install the drivers and set-up the drivers - but they may or may not be able to MAKE you the device that runs MyMovies. They can still make it work if you already have one, or buy a licensed device from someone who makes them for you.

This is the biggest problem... Most folks I know aren't going to spring for a new device simply to move meta data into the C4 GUI.

C4 should look into incorporating MyMovies into the controller

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[msgreenf]

I dont think EV wants to be supporting thousands of installs of MM.  This makes sense to have a dealer as support.  This is no different then the c4 dealer model

[Cyknight]

This is the biggest problem... Most folks I know aren't going to spring for a new device simply to move meta data into the C4 GUI.

C4 should look into incorporating MyMovies into the controller

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

You still don't need to, you can still have the Pro suite setup on an existing computer, though that WOULD require someone MM licensed.

 

Also, most people do not need to have a separate device, most people using C4 and have movie collections get a solution that rips, stores and plays movies. Whether that is something based on MyMovies, Fusion, or other systems.

 

Most people on these forums is not representative of most people using C4 and movie servers, or even most people using C4 and MyMovies and movie servers.

Don't forget, though a highly vocal group of people, and largely people with a more advanced understanding, we are less than 700 forum members (not even taking into consideration those members that aren't strictly end-users) on here - I don't have any real numbers, but I suspect EV has sold more MyMovies licenses then there are forum members. I sure have purchased my share of them, with many more to come most likely - but non of them run using MyMovies on a client's desk-top. Every one of them is on a dedicated device - and yes by a 3rd (or are we at 4th or 5th ) party licensed to do so.

 

I certainly agree that if Control4 would make their own database option better (and let's update the interface abilities while we're at it), using MyMovies or something else, they may just make 3rd party MyMovies integration completely obsolete - which certainly would get my vote.

After all the ONLY reason MyMovies collection management was integrated in the first place is to assist a lacking Control4 movie database management but still be able to use the Control4 interfaces to browse and select the movies.

[SMHarman]

{snip}- I don't have any real numbers, but I suspect EV has sold more MyMovies licenses then there are forum members. I sure have purchased my share of them, with many more to come most likely - but non of them run using MyMovies on a client's desk-top. {snip}

 

But EV have never sold a single one of those MM licences.  The dealer or end user has bought it - 2500 points - direct from MM as was instructed in the EV instructions.

 

I guess the proactive dealers will need to reach out to any customer that they has the MM / EV solution and advise them to contact MM to get thier API unlocked or have irate customers calling complaining their system does not work properly anymore.

 

I hope EV reaches out to all the dealers that they sold licences to and gives them a script of what to do to keep these customers rolling along.

[wappinghigh]

Oh, and yes I very much agree that this is going to take quite a bit of explaining to many current users, both in- and outside the Control4 group that happens to be MyMovies users as well.

 

Time will tell what the overall effects will end up being.

 

One would ALMOST start thinking like Wap and say that everything should just be free and unprotected.

I do *not* think anything of the sort..

 

Movies and media could have DRM removed (just like music) to make life a heck of a lot easier for the general consumer, not to mention the entire industry, but still remain "protected"...and folks could still pay for the content. 

 

Just like they do on Netflix, Pandora and the like..

 

Has it not occurred to you MyMovies is basically a ripping program?

 

For all you know end users could be using it with (unpaid) content.

 

I pay for for *all* my movie and media content.

 

Please retract your comment, because it is totally unfounded and nothing to do with the discussion..

[Binnerup]

But EV have never sold a single one of those MM licences.  The dealer or end user has bought it - 2500 points - direct from MM as was instructed in the EV instructions.

 

These incorrect instructions in the EV documentation is the main reason that we are rebating the purchases dealers have made for customers against the sign-up fee for our installer program, and supply a license to be applied on the machines instead, if the provider joins the installer program.

 

This is something we also have asked EV to change, and was instructed this way due to lack of communication between our companies when this was started - we had not been aware of this incorrect information until recently.

 

Based on this thread, we can certainly see that the situation may affect more users than we expected - we are going to take a discussion with EV, to see if we can do something to inform the users, perhaps when installing My Movies 5 - I do not know if we perhaps can detect the precense of the driver on the machine, and instruct the user if we find it, prior to installing.

 

This is something we have to discuss with EV.

[Cyknight]

I guess if I were doing this, and as stated, all the changes planned were discussed with EV, then why not make EV the licenced partner who provides an installation payload appropriate for the product ordered rather than add another set of hoops for dealers.  Afterall, EV are troubleshooting these installations at present where dealers get into trouble.

 

EV could then sell a driver plus a branded copy of MM to the dealer and supervise / troubleshoot the installation process.

 

 

Support requirement for EV would triple if not more, because THEY would be the authorized party. I sincerely doubt they want that headache.

Also, technically, they would have to provide the hardware running the software (under the proposed changes) - something I'm sure they don't care to get into.

 

Even if they did want to deal with it, MyMovies and it's management team is NOT you, and it's in the end their choice to make, not yours. Having talked to EV on how to handle their user base in light of the changes in MM5 does not mean EV was involved in anything beyond coming up with a solution for existing users and being told to change the wording in their descriptions either.

If anything, that talk at the very least seems to have had the effect of coming up with a solution for those users, as opposed to leaving them hanging. Taking the changes as a given, that at least is commendable of EV, MM or the two of them together, whomever may have initiated and carried it.

 

Whether MyMovies made the right, fair, understandable, good, worst of two evils or anything on the other side of those coins choice here or not is a different matter. I have my doubts but I don't see them changing it until it's clear which it is.