AK1 Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CFUG Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 DVDs and BR was just a generic term for an A/V device. So let's use the terms Roku or Apple TV or Amazon Fire TV or Xbox One instead, assuming these devices have IR or IP control. A Roku plastic box fits into a landfill nicely too. All that crap is "here-for-today" toys. Post #173- bottom comment. Look at that! Who the hell spends $600k and losses it all in 4 yrs.? A Control4 customer? NO! A fool. A well engineered Control4 backbone requires little ongoing investment. A wise customer weighs the choice of adds or upgrades against the family's needs. Unless of course one treats all of this as a hobby... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CFUG Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 there is a lot of Netflix content that is DVD or BD only.Sent from my LT26i using TapatalkSeriously, I'm not fighting hard-copy/players, I'm wondering why someone north of $100k annual income is bitching about $100 to install anything. Just do it and hold your installer accountable for the job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CFUG Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 This thread is still going.........Yeah, because it gets more ridiculous as time goes on. Maybe you could start a thread about how you've installed/used several successful systems. Whose gonna post in that thread? I've stopped tooting the C4 horn because, let's face it, it's not that interesting. Control4 works so well it's "Everday" boring Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AK1 Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 Seriously, I'm not fighting hard-copy/players, I'm wondering why someone north of $100k annual income is bitching about $100 to install anything. Just do it and hold your installer accountable for the job. That's not the point. The point is about choosing to having ownership of your project and wanting to do these tasks yourself. And not to mention the convenience of doing it on your own schedule and not waiting on your dealer. It's about choice: I choose to pay someone to cut my grass, I choose to work on my own C4 system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CFUG Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 It is the point. You just said it yourself. You hire-out your lawn service, you can hire-out your C4 maintenance. You can always tell your mow&blow idiots not to do it during lunchtime and they follow. Just tell dealer you need it done for this price. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AK1 Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 It is the point. You just said it yourself. You hire-out your lawn service, you can hire-out your C4 maintenance. You can always tell your mow&blow idiots not to do it during lunchtime and they follow. Just tell dealer you need it done for this price. No, you're missing the point. I choose not to hire someone to work on my C4 system because I like working on it. I don't like cutting my lawn. My money, my time and my choices. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AHA Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 Some one pass us the pop corn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snaffle8 Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 That's not the point. The point is about choosing to having ownership of your project and wanting to do these tasks yourself. And not to mention the convenience of doing it on your own schedule and not waiting on your dealer. It's about choice: I choose to pay someone to cut my grass, I choose to work on my own C4 system.You should have chose a DIY system then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
texas3622 Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 That is a good point. Maybe I should have chosen a DYI system. Now that I didn't I certainly make sure that I tell that to all my friends so that they don't get caught up in this trap. No one wants to be in a constant loop where they are paying for every tiny thing. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SMHarman Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 But what are you constantly changing in your system that needs pro not home? Sent from my LT26i using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snaffle8 Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 ".....And the number 1 reason end users cannot have a copy of Composer Pro....(drum roll)....Because it's Control4's policy" Yay, boo,yay, boo, yay, boo, yay, boo.....(drop microphone) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neil12011 Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 But that does not stop the dealer from doing remote maintainance. I have a realationship with mine such that I install a light switch or IP controlled device or whatever and drop him an email / call. Sometime in the next 48 hrs, usually an evening he will call and remote in to the system to do whatever work needed doing. My involvement is in pressing keypad buttons and telling him the name for them. "Usually" I can add small stuff for just about anyone within the day, time permitting. The whole composer pro thing can go on and on forever, but I understand the inherent frustration that comes with having to reach out to a dealer to add anything. That being said, I try to meet clients in the middle, and I've never charged someone to add a light switch or anything like that, if it takes a few minutes, and they're happy, then game on. I think the right choice in a dealer can minimize the composer pro aspect, but that's just me. I've also been on the end-user side also, so I suppose I take more things into consideration when working with clients. I try to remember what qualities would have made me willingly fork over my hard earned dollars, and what level of service would impress me. Yes, we obviously have a bottom line, but that's not why a lot of us are "here". Ultimately, it's the passion for the industry, and the affinity for all things "gadgety". It's the same reason so many dealers on here post here, offering advice, troubleshooting, etc, on their own time. Look at Cytexone, they host this entire forum, for the sole benefit of helping the community. Dealers have their own forum, but C4forums was created because the guys at Cytexone love what they do, not to make a dime off the back of Control4 system owners. I guess what I'm trying to say is, between Composer HE, and a solid dealer, I think Control4 is a great platform, which is obvious, otherwise I wouldn't spend hours upon hours of my life on the forums. It doesn't matter what I think about their business model, or whether or not Composer Pro should be available to end users, because a excellent dealer will provide excellent service regardless, and the value will be in that service. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wappinghigh Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 But what are you constantly changing in your system that needs pro not home?Sent from my LT26i using TapatalkWell folks tend to live in a world of constantly changing media content, ever evolving audio and video formats and resolutions and "modern families".... They are also constantly exposed on an almost hourly basis, to other other software platforms that sell downloads, apps and have firmware upgrades that work in a far more efficient and timely manner... So I guess I'm saying get used to it, because this issue aint ever going to go away.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wappinghigh Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 ^ I mean a static world is just not the real world.. Well not the one I live in anyway. Cheers and have a good weekend everyone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cdepaola Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 But what are you constantly changing in your system that needs pro not home?Sent from my LT26i using TapatalkI've got agree here... I change a bluray player maybe once ever 3-5 years and TV's about 5-8 years (maybe). Pre-amps and amps almost never, a good preamp amp or receiver should last a long time. I may add something new occasionally like a new streamer or similar. It would be nice if Pro was an add-on but it doesn't keep me ffrom recommending Control4 to people including municipal clients I work with on other things. My experience has been that the stuff they make is rock solid and just works so it's hard not to recommend it. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cdepaola Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 Well folks tend to live in a world of constantly changing media content, ever evolving audio and video formats and resolutions and "modern families".... They are also constantly exposed on an almost hourly basis, to other other software platforms that sell downloads, apps and have firmware upgrades that work in a far more efficient and timely manner... So I guess I'm saying get used to it, because this issue aint ever going to go away..This is because your chasing the perfect all in one solution. I've got bad news, it doesn't exist so you can stop. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SMHarman Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 Well folks tend to live in a world of constantly changing media content, ever evolving audio and video formats and resolutions and "modern families".... They are also constantly exposed on an almost hourly basis, to other other software platforms that sell downloads, apps and have firmware upgrades that work in a far more efficient and timely manner... So I guess I'm saying get used to it, because this issue aint ever going to go away..ok I get that but with a zone player, Apple tv, Roku and video matrix how often are you really buying new devices. Maybe I'm the weird one. I probably buy one new source a year and lately that is replacement cycle Roku xds for Roku 3 was the latest source switch. Which, by the way could be substituted in home. No pro required.Sent from my LT26i using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
texas3622 Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 It is pretty amazing that the people who have pro here are trying to come up with every conceivable reason for users not to have pro. You look at the posts on this forum and there are so many people who have pro but have no clue how to use it. So this argument that we would somehow destroy our systems is one I am unwilling to accept. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
texas3622 Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 And what do people care if I use it once or every day? It is about control. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
texas3622 Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 So if I call a dealer for everything they can act all busy and say they will get to it whenever and then I wait around for them to do it and pay them for waiting around. Great business model!! Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
texas3622 Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 And now that I am in a rant - no company, irrespective of industry, becomes successful by being beholden to its distribution network. It is the customers that will eventually make or sink the company - ie the endusers Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AK1 Posted April 5, 2014 Share Posted April 5, 2014 You should have chose a DIY system then. Ah, but that's not the issue being discussed in this topic. We already know C4 is a dealer-centric system. That's the status quo. This topic is about an excellent suggestion made by our UK mate Gary how to get Composer Pro into the hands of DIY users without upsetting the balance or structure of the dealer network. In other words, it's a suggestion about change. Whether change happens remains to be seen, but the discussion is certainly healthy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
texas3622 Posted April 5, 2014 Share Posted April 5, 2014 I will echo the suggestions made by others: 1. You need a dealer to install the project 2. Access pro just like you do HE but limit access to your own controller 3. If you buy something/install a driver - get an option if you want dealer to install or DYI. Charge a fee for the drivers that you want to sell or hardware and if you want dealer install or have a problem then pay a fee to dealer to complete the process. 90% will want dealers to do everything but it keeps those of us who are like myself happy and we keep bragging how great the system is. Win win. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
texas3622 Posted April 5, 2014 Share Posted April 5, 2014 And for the dealers that feel threatened - if the perception is that this is a user friendly system then you will probably do more installs. Get people on the big stuff - don't nickel and dime for the small stuff. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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