anon2828 Posted December 28, 2021 Share Posted December 28, 2021 Apple Music in Control4 Yup, I know - Shairbridge (still trying to figure out why spelled that way)... I've been using the native Amazon Music integration which I like very much, but still think a native Apple Music integration would be even better in a house full of iOS and Mac OS devices. Where if anywhere is Control4 on this? Seems like in this day and age of just about every streaming service being available on just about every device that having Apple Music native on Control4 only makes sense. Streaming from a device has disadvantages if the device moves off of the LAN, and streaming quality is typically not as good, not to mention the ability for multiple household members to play DJ. C'mon Control4 (or I am sure everyone will blame Apple)...either way...let's go already... TundraSonic 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Control4Savant Posted December 28, 2021 Share Posted December 28, 2021 8 minutes ago, anon2828 said: Apple Music in Control4 Yup, I know - Shairbridge (still trying to figure out why spelled that way)... I've been using the native Amazon Music integration which I like very much, but still think a native Apple Music integration would be even better in a house full of iOS and Mac OS devices. Where if anywhere is Control4 on this? Seems like in this day and age of just about every streaming service being available on just about every device that having Apple Music native on Control4 only makes sense. Streaming from a device has disadvantages if the device moves off of the LAN, and streaming quality is typically not as good, not to mention the ability for multiple household members to play DJ. C'mon Control4 (or I am sure everyone will blame Apple)...either way...let's go already... Id love to blame C4 but this is a Liftmaster/MyQ type of conversation and the whole pro industry is up ….creek…. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mstafford388 Posted December 28, 2021 Share Posted December 28, 2021 7 hours ago, anon2828 said: Where if anywhere is Control4 on this? They are willing, don't have cooperation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cdcllc Posted December 28, 2021 Share Posted December 28, 2021 7 hours ago, anon2828 said: Yup, I know - Shairbridge (still trying to figure out why spelled that way)... Marketing wizards at Apple wanted a link to "Airplay" w/ Sh"air"bridge - surprised it didn't come out ShairPlay Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ekohn00 Posted December 28, 2021 Share Posted December 28, 2021 1 hour ago, mstafford388 said: They are willing, don't have cooperation. I love my C4.....but seriously don't believe that. If they felt the need it would be done. I'd believe more that there's not enough demand for development $$, and shairbridge is a happy medium. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msgreenf Posted December 28, 2021 Share Posted December 28, 2021 Just now, ekohn00 said: seriously don't believe that. If they felt the need it would be done. That's really not how it works. They can't just decide they want to do it and do it. It takes two to tango Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mstafford388 Posted December 28, 2021 Share Posted December 28, 2021 8 minutes ago, ekohn00 said: I love my C4.....but seriously don't believe that. If they felt the need it would be done. I'd believe more that there's not enough demand for development $$, and shairbridge is a happy medium. I get it it's frustrating, but you not believing it doesn't mean it's not true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lippavisual Posted December 28, 2021 Share Posted December 28, 2021 Plus the licensing $$ Apple most likely wants would be ridiculous. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitneyd Posted December 28, 2021 Share Posted December 28, 2021 Is Apple Music directly available on any other products, that aren’t Apple products? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew luecke Posted December 29, 2021 Share Posted December 29, 2021 19 hours ago, anon2828 said: Apple Music in Control4 Yup, I know - Shairbridge (still trying to figure out why spelled that way)... I've been using the native Amazon Music integration which I like very much, but still think a native Apple Music integration would be even better in a house full of iOS and Mac OS devices. Where if anywhere is Control4 on this? Seems like in this day and age of just about every streaming service being available on just about every device that having Apple Music native on Control4 only makes sense. Streaming from a device has disadvantages if the device moves off of the LAN, and streaming quality is typically not as good, not to mention the ability for multiple household members to play DJ. C'mon Control4 (or I am sure everyone will blame Apple)...either way...let's go already... Firstly, this is personal opinion. I agree it is likely NOT Control4's fault. Control4 is very likely trying to get Apple Music support, but a lot of the negotiating would possibly be about policies / politics (from Apple) than anything else. Control4 definitely has the know-how to implement Apple music. The fact that nobody is supporting Apple Music suggests the issues are with Apple.. When people develop for Apple, they have to give up a lot (which is why Apple is getting sued in so many countries now). Some evidence of the hostility, is stuff like: forcing developers to use their sign in system (clearly for the purpose of self-benefit): https://developer.apple.com/forums/thread/124006 . Blatantly kicking out competing apps Delaying competitors products (like the Pebble, which was still awaiting approval weeks later). I'm guessing approval time for apps is still long too.. https://www.ilounge.com/index.php/news/comments/apple-developers-fight-over-tightening-iphone-nda . They've also always had NDA's in place, which stifle developers from talking about policies https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epic_Games_v._Apple Whilst traditionally they used to support open standards, slowly, they drifted further from that too recently with depreciating OpenGL for their own API (Metal), and not supporting Vulkan. In fact to give you an idea of how ridiculous things seemingly are sometimes when dealing with Apple, shortly before Boot camp was released 20 years ago, a national (?) sales manager at Apple Australia basically called me an idiot (with customers around) for demonstrating that the new Intel Macs were a great transition technology by demonstrating windows on it ("why would people want to run windows?" was part of his response). A week later, boot camp was out, and he was proudly in our showroom repeating the exact same arguments I had made a week earlier and pretended the initial conversation never took place. Whereas, companies like Control4 foster 3rd party development and directly support 3rd party development (the control4 team is great to deal with all around), and ideas are readily considered If Control4 introduced Apple Music, don't be surprised if the demands made by Apple were similar to making it the prominent music service, automatically installing the driver, plastering it everywhere in control4, requiring Apple ID login support etc. It also wouldn't surprise me if Control4 was required to report additional information (which could be utilised anti-competitively). I'd assume they would also require that they could change their policies at any time, or their API with short warning, etc. It is also entirely possible they would dictate the required hardware too and would require Control4 to pay them additional money If Control4 added Apple Music, they'd likely need to give up a LOT (if Apple permitted it at all), and the terms of any contract would be under NDA anyway (Control4 might be working on it, but unable to talk about it). Unless the terms are similar to other providers, I personally think it would be a really bad thing for Control4 to add support long-term. There are so many competing music services around customers can use. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DawnGordon Posted December 29, 2021 Share Posted December 29, 2021 13 hours ago, Andrew luecke said: Firstly, this is personal opinion. I agree it is likely NOT Control4's fault. Control4 is very likely trying to get Apple Music support, but a lot of the negotiating would possibly be about policies / politics (from Apple) than anything else. Control4 definitely has the know-how to implement Apple music. The fact that nobody is supporting Apple Music suggests the issues are with Apple.. When people develop for Apple, they have to give up a lot (which is why Apple is getting sued in so many countries now). Some evidence of the hostility, is stuff like: forcing developers to use their sign in system (clearly for the purpose of self-benefit): https://developer.apple.com/forums/thread/124006 . Blatantly kicking out competing apps Delaying competitors products (like the Pebble, which was still awaiting approval weeks later). I'm guessing approval time for apps is still long too.. https://www.ilounge.com/index.php/news/comments/apple-developers-fight-over-tightening-iphone-nda . They've also always had NDA's in place, which stifle developers from talking about policies https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epic_Games_v._Apple Whilst traditionally they used to support open standards, slowly, they drifted further from that too recently with depreciating OpenGL for their own API (Metal), and not supporting Vulkan. In fact to give you an idea of how ridiculous things seemingly are sometimes when dealing with Apple, shortly before Boot camp was released 20 years ago, a national (?) sales manager at Apple Australia basically called me an idiot (with customers around) for demonstrating that the new Intel Macs were a great transition technology by demonstrating windows on it ("why would people want to run windows?" was part of his response). A week later, boot camp was out, and he was proudly in our showroom repeating the exact same arguments I had made a week earlier and pretended the initial conversation never took place. Whereas, companies like Control4 foster 3rd party development and directly support 3rd party development (the control4 team is great to deal with all around), and ideas are readily considered If Control4 introduced Apple Music, don't be surprised if the demands made by Apple were similar to making it the prominent music service, automatically installing the driver, plastering it everywhere in control4, requiring Apple ID login support etc. It also wouldn't surprise me if Control4 was required to report additional information (which could be utilised anti-competitively). I'd assume they would also require that they could change their policies at any time, or their API with short warning, etc. It is also entirely possible they would dictate the required hardware too and would require Control4 to pay them additional money If Control4 added Apple Music, they'd likely need to give up a LOT (if Apple permitted it at all), and the terms of any contract would be under NDA anyway (Control4 might be working on it, but unable to talk about it). Unless the terms are similar to other providers, I personally think it would be a really bad thing for Control4 to add support long-term. There are so many competing music services around customers can use. Apple's draconian rules are the reason I switched to Android and never looked back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TundraSonic Posted December 29, 2021 Share Posted December 29, 2021 I live in Unix, Windows and Apple worlds. Unix/Linix and Apple are overwhelmingly the more stable and reliable platforms. The only reason I run Windows is for apps that are Windows only or the Windows app has features that the Unix or Apple do not. Mostly these are scientific apps... And Composer. In Apple's defense, their controlled/closed system has resulted in a quite stable and secure platform. For the most part things just work and always work. Those of us in the Apple Universe are generally quite happy with how stuff works across multiple platforms. Unfortunately they've declined in reliability over the past 10 years but hopefully they'll reverse that. OTOH, they can be a bit too closed and things like not working w/ C4 to implement Apple Music is irritating. A pseudo solution is to stick an Apple TV in the rack and use that to pipe Apple Music. But then there's the issue of not being able to control Apple TV , so you have to use an iphone or ATV remote to do it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zaphod Posted December 29, 2021 Share Posted December 29, 2021 IMO the best solution in an iOS plus C4 household is Spotify. It isn't native within the C4 UI but I prefer the Spotify phone/iPad UI for finding and starting music and then you just play to a Spotify device. This is better than Shairplay as once the Spotify connect stream is consummated your phone is removed from the equation. I have tried Tidal and Amazon Music and they each have drawbacks, especially if you want to stick to one service for C4 plus other uses like phone, car, etc. LollerAgent 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Control4Savant Posted December 30, 2021 Share Posted December 30, 2021 On 12/28/2021 at 8:43 AM, ekohn00 said: I love my C4.....but seriously don't believe that. If they felt the need it would be done. I'd believe more that there's not enough demand for development $$, and shairbridge is a happy medium. I don’t love C4… and it’s still not any different on my Savant systems running on Apple hosts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eddy.trochez Posted December 30, 2021 Share Posted December 30, 2021 On 12/28/2021 at 3:43 AM, ekohn00 said: I love my C4.....but seriously don't believe that. If they felt the need it would be done. I'd believe more that there's not enough demand for development $$, and shairbridge is a happy medium. This comment couldn't be further away from the truth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Topspin14m Posted December 31, 2021 Share Posted December 31, 2021 On 12/28/2021 at 4:57 PM, whitneyd said: Is Apple Music directly available on any other products, that aren’t Apple products? Sonos Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msgreenf Posted December 31, 2021 Share Posted December 31, 2021 1 hour ago, Topspin14m said: Sonos And that was pre existing. It was beats... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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