eggzlot Posted June 3, 2023 Share Posted June 3, 2023 Just now, penn65000 said: I go with only C4 drivers as I think third party will ultimately disappoint. Thx for your thoughts. They are helpful. Will ultimate switch to Lutron lighting which works w c4 and savant. I have a full 4,000 sq ft home 100% on c4 lighting. Minus my gripe with older hardware (from 2014) with sub par LED backlighting, the lights themselves just flat out work. Lutron is nice because it is system agnostic, but I do like the single/double/triple tap of the c4 keypads. Adds tons of functionality that we use often. c44me, South Africa C4 user, Neo1738 and 1 other 2 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Control4Savant Posted June 3, 2023 Share Posted June 3, 2023 8 minutes ago, eggzlot said: I have a full 4,000 sq ft home 100% on c4 lighting. Minus my gripe with older hardware (from 2014) with sub par LED backlighting, the lights themselves just flat out work. Lutron is nice because it is system agnostic, but I do like the single/double/triple tap of the c4 keypads. Adds tons of functionality that we use often. This is why you DO use system keypads! It keeps any changeover in the future to a minimal cost. and I totally get HE existing. There is certainly nothing negative about it being available. I just dont accept that in 2023 some of those things shouldnt be inside user app system settings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
penn65000 Posted June 3, 2023 Author Share Posted June 3, 2023 8 minutes ago, Control4Savant said: This is why you DO use system keypads! It keeps any changeover in the future to a minimal cost. and I totally get HE existing. There is certainly nothing negative about it being available. I just dont accept that in 2023 some of those things shouldnt be inside user app system settings. What do you mean system keypads? Thx. Our issues are with the 6 button keypads mostly. All have issues w delays and losing functionality. Again c4 has been out, new controller, stronger mesh, power conditioners on sump pump, swap hardware etc. problems persist. C4 claims interference but don’t believe that because even dealer admits more interference in apt buildings and they don’t have issues in that setting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msgreenf Posted June 3, 2023 Share Posted June 3, 2023 2 hours ago, Control4Savant said: a dealer sucks, your install will suck. Irrelevant to brand. 100% But I have never seen a keypad lose programming. That to me points to corruption in the project Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Control4Savant Posted June 3, 2023 Share Posted June 3, 2023 17 minutes ago, penn65000 said: What do you mean system keypads? Thx. Our issues are with the 6 button keypads mostly. All have issues w delays and losing functionality. Again c4 has been out, new controller, stronger mesh, power conditioners on sump pump, swap hardware etc. problems persist. C4 claims interference but don’t believe that because even dealer admits more interference in apt buildings and they don’t have issues in that setting. If you spec a system with Lutron dimmers, switches, fan controllers and outlet modules you can use a proprietary keypad for scene and system control. 14 minutes ago, msgreenf said: 100% But I have never seen a keypad lose programming. That to me points to corruption in the project Yeah…that sounds system specific, not one of the persistent knowledge base issues. Delays are solvable, cant say iv seen programming disappear from a keypad in many many years. You say C4 has been out, but I assume you mean your dealer who again is just a joe from down the street selling a product line. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eggzlot Posted June 3, 2023 Share Posted June 3, 2023 1 hour ago, Control4Savant said: If you spec a system with Lutron dimmers, switches, fan controllers and outlet modules you can use a proprietary keypad for scene and system control. Yeah…that sounds system specific, not one of the persistent knowledge base issues. Delays are solvable, cant say iv seen programming disappear from a keypad in many many years. You say C4 has been out, but I assume you mean your dealer who again is just a joe from down the street selling a product line. So you suggest mixing Lutron and C4 (or Savant) switches/keypads in the same bank? That wouldn’t be appealing to the eye, at least wouldn’t pass my wife’s approval. And even the c4 dimmer or switch can do single/double and triple tap. When I leave my office I double tap the bottom rocker on the dimmer and lights go out and room goes off so turns off a radio or tv. No keypad needed for a simple small office. msgreenf 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msgreenf Posted June 3, 2023 Share Posted June 3, 2023 I use the double tap room off for the entire room. Quite a lot too BXTR 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
South Africa C4 user Posted June 3, 2023 Share Posted June 3, 2023 Single tap lights off, double tap AV off, triple tap all off is my standard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RyanE Posted June 4, 2023 Share Posted June 4, 2023 On 6/3/2023 at 5:47 AM, eggzlot said: could be wrong but don’t think Savant offers a tool like that and I have to think 10+ years ago that software drove a helpful group of people to start a forum This forum was originally started by Control4 dealers, before Control4 started their forums. Dealers quickly moved mostly over to Control4's forums, and this one became more homeowner populated. RyanE eggzlot 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eggzlot Posted June 4, 2023 Share Posted June 4, 2023 56 minutes ago, RyanE said: This forum was originally started by Control4 dealers, before Control4 started their forums. Dealers quickly moved mostly over to Control4's forums, and this one became more homeowner populated. RyanE I still think having HE has helped this forum continue while a lack of such tool has hampered other user forums for other platforms Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amr Posted June 4, 2023 Share Posted June 4, 2023 2 hours ago, eggzlot said: I still think having HE has helped this forum continue while a lack of such tool has hampered other user forums for other platforms Other platforms doesn’t even have a forum, aka Savant! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Murch_DES Posted June 5, 2023 Share Posted June 5, 2023 I'm new to C4 and still relatively young (4 years) with knowing Savant's lineup. I agree with @Control4Savant take. Going from Savant to C4 can be a bit startling because the options expand so much. That being said Savant doing most of their own Profiles delivers a bit more comfort in knowing things work. I also agree that video feeds have to be in main interface. Savant's investment in lighting is 2nd to none in the space. The Lighting Manager for speccing USAI lights is drop dead simple. As a guy that used to be in solar the UI for viewing energy is "already" better than 90% of the existing market. I think Control 4 can make hay in the midmarket but a 1%'er home is going to come off very well with a Savant system especially if it's a new construction home because you can integrate branch circuits, lighting loads and energy monitoring all in the same panels connected to ESS storage. I'm excited though to see where the next few years takes this vertical regardless. Control4Savant 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Control4Savant Posted June 5, 2023 Share Posted June 5, 2023 17 hours ago, Amr said: Other platforms doesn’t even have a forum, aka Savant! Other platforms don’t need constant troubleshooting by end users and copy and paste dealers. penn65000 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msgreenf Posted June 5, 2023 Share Posted June 5, 2023 32 minutes ago, Control4Savant said: Other platforms don’t need constant troubleshooting by end users and copy and paste dealers. Control4 doesn’t either but this forum represents the 1% that likes to tweak and the 1% that had poor dealer setups to begin with. Amr 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amr Posted June 5, 2023 Share Posted June 5, 2023 3 hours ago, Control4Savant said: Other platforms don’t need constant troubleshooting by end users and copy and paste dealers. I don’t know how did you get this information or conclude this wrongly, whomever endusers here are not all with issues. In my country with many C4 IB, only me is here! Majority of Endusers here either learning or pushing the curve for things not Savant or any other HA system can normally achieve; people who just love to tinker and try new things, even u as a dealer represents % of your clientele don’t represent the general mass. You said u want to start a Savant forum, for what reason? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
South Africa C4 user Posted June 5, 2023 Share Posted June 5, 2023 (edited) 23 hours ago, msgreenf said: Control4 doesn’t either but this forum represents the 1% that likes to tweak and the 1% that had poor dealer setups to begin with. While I agree 100% with the sentiment… I would say the percentages are a bit wrong… it would be the 0.1% who like to tweak and the 10% who get a poor dealer setup (my view - and this is not a dig at C4 or any of the dealers on this forum). Admittedly many of the 10% won’t find their way here. Edited June 6, 2023 by South Africa C4 user msgreenf, BXTR, Neo1738 and 2 others 3 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amr Posted June 5, 2023 Share Posted June 5, 2023 2 hours ago, msgreenf said: Control4 doesn’t either but this forum represents the 1% that likes to tweak and the 1% that had poor dealer setups to begin with. I agree, bad installers or unfinished business hits every HA out there, C4 is one of them! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew luecke Posted June 6, 2023 Share Posted June 6, 2023 16 hours ago, Control4Savant said: Other platforms don’t need constant troubleshooting by end users and copy and paste dealers. I personally only had 4 new support tickets this morning for the drivers I wrote/contributed to. My tickets were: Feature request for LIFX (for a feature which most Automation platforms don't even support an option for) An implementation question about TRVs and boilers. Integration issue between LIFX and Alexa (which is not a bug, but more a behavior) VLAN's and Wiz issue due to UDP broadcasts. At worst, its network, at best, they forgot to configure C4 for the correct broadcast range. In regards to phone calls Had a call about Govee. Customer seems to have moved the lights to their own account, so the API key of course broke. Our Inbuilt diagnostics made this easy to diagnose.. TPLink call regarding outlets. It was mentioned to them we have a new driver, so they simply wanted to upgrade it to our 2nd generation driver. I'd personally expect a lot more tickets from dealers/end-users if there was "constant troubleshooting". In fact, for drivers like Big Ass Fans V2, I've literally only received 1 issue on an existing system, ever... There are a lot of systems using our drivers.. Based on my experience (and my previous experience as an installer), I'd have to totally disagree.. rea, Cinegration, msgreenf and 1 other 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BXTR Posted June 6, 2023 Share Posted June 6, 2023 22 hours ago, Control4Savant said: Other platforms don’t need constant troubleshooting by end users and copy and paste dealers. That’s wildly inaccurate and is more related to the quality of the dealer rather than the platform We just flew 4 hours to deploy a 5th system for a client of ours at his newest property. People don’t do this if the system is unreliable I’ll admit that there’s a ton of crappy dealers out there but reliability 99.9% of the time comes down to system/network design and also standing ground when the client asks if it can be done cheaper RyanE, South Africa C4 user and msgreenf 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
penn65000 Posted June 6, 2023 Author Share Posted June 6, 2023 6 hours ago, Andrew luecke said: I personally only had 4 new support tickets this morning for the drivers I wrote/contributed to. My tickets were: Feature request for LIFX (for a feature which most Automation platforms don't even support an option for) An implementation question about TRVs and boilers. Integration issue between LIFX and Alexa (which is not a bug, but more a behavior) VLAN's and Wiz issue due to UDP broadcasts. At worst, its network, at best, they forgot to configure C4 for the correct broadcast range. In regards to phone calls Had a call about Govee. Customer seems to have moved the lights to their own account, so the API key of course broke. Our Inbuilt diagnostics made this easy to diagnose.. TPLink call regarding outlets. It was mentioned to them we have a new driver, so they simply wanted to upgrade it to our 2nd generation driver. I'd personally expect a lot more tickets from dealers/end-users if there was "constant troubleshooting". In fact, for drivers like Big Ass Fans V2, I've literally only received 1 issue on an existing system, ever... There are a lot of systems using our drivers.. Based on my experience (and my previous experience as an installer), I'd have to totally disagree.. 17 minutes ago, BXTR said: That’s wildly inaccurate and is more related to the quality of the dealer rather than the platform We just flew 4 hours to deploy a 5th system for a client of ours at his newest property. People don’t do this if the system is unreliable I’ll admit that there’s a ton of crappy dealers out there but reliability 99.9% of the time comes down to system/network design and also standing ground when the client asks if it can be done cheaper So suspect you’ve not installed any Neeos or T4s correct? SpencerT 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BXTR Posted June 6, 2023 Share Posted June 6, 2023 1 hour ago, penn65000 said: So suspect you’ve not installed any Neeos or T4s correct? I’ll respond even though you have a chip on your shoulder Tons of T4’s, zero issues 1 Neeo at my own house, recognized that it was in my mind at least, it was a poor execution of a premium remote and made the choice as a company to not promote them A big difference between an average dealer and a great one is that a great one will tell you what you need to know instead of what you want to hear. Many dealers don’t have the balls to do so DawnGordon, penn65000, msgreenf and 2 others 4 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msgreenf Posted June 6, 2023 Share Posted June 6, 2023 No T4 issues either DawnGordon 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neo1738 Posted June 6, 2023 Share Posted June 6, 2023 Only have 1 t4 (replaced dead t3) and no issues. 2 Neeo and 1 says "waiting for network" about 1x/mo other about 1x/2 mo. Nothing crazy for wireless devices imo. I realize I'm the rarity in this board w good Neeo experience. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msgreenf Posted June 6, 2023 Share Posted June 6, 2023 I have good neeo network experiences - I just find the device lags too much refreshing. Don't think that is network SpencerT 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpencerT Posted June 6, 2023 Share Posted June 6, 2023 20 hours ago, msgreenf said: I have good neeo network experiences - I just find the device lags too much refreshing. Don't think that is network This for me as well. I am another outcast that actually really likes my Neeos. I don't have the "waiting for network" issues, when I pick one up, it's ready to go. My only issue has been the lag switching between rooms (2-3 seconds while it sits on the "refreshing settings" screen). My guess would be memory on the device. I wish they would show all of the proxies that our phones and tablets show (pool, security panel, etc.). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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